Luftwaffe Cannons & Machineguns.

[Uyraell]

Originally Posted by Panzerknacker

Hmmmm..thanks but the gun definately is not a MG 151/20, this cannon have a different muzzle and the barrel was shorter.

Must be some kind of experimental weapon, I saw a MG 204, but no a 404.

If memory serves, the MG404 (being the German assigned designation) is in fact a French weapon impressed into Luftwaffe use, in Sea Reconnaiscance Wings.

From memory, it was taken from manufactured stocks that had been intended for fitting in the various turret and tunnel gun/ventral turret installations of the S.E 100 Heavy Fighter.

Source: William Green , "Warplanes of the Second World War, Fighters, Volume One".

Regards, Uyraell.

[Panzerknacker]

Yes, I tought that it was a german design but in the end was the trusty Hispano gun. Well, not so trusty, it jammed a lot in the early cannon armed Spitfires.

Aditional images of Rheinmetall Borsig MK 103 30mm gun.

[Uyraell]

Yes PK, you are correct. Though to be fair, the RAF armourers were at that point unfamiliar with the weapon.
Once they gained experience, the amount of jams reduced, as I understand it.
Certainly in the Mediterranean theater the Hispano-derived cannons performed quite well, which has always surprised me, in as much as that theater was where it could be expected that performance issues would be of the greatest number.

Regards, Uyraell.

[Tony Williams]

Originally Posted by Uyraell

Yes PK, you are correct. Though to be fair, the RAF armourers were at that point unfamiliar with the weapon.
Once they gained experience, the amount of jams reduced, as I understand it.

In 1944 the RAF Hispanos had an average stoppage rate of once in every 1,500 rounds, compared with once in about 4,500 rounds for the .50 Browning.

[Panzerknacker]

In 1944 the RAF Hispanos had an average stoppage rate of once in every 1,500 rounds, compared with once in about 4,500 rounds for the .50 Browning

Wich is not good, and that was in 1944, after almost 4 years working in clear the "bugs" in the Birgkit gun. Unfortunately I havent see a record of the French Air force to compare.

[Uyraell]

Originally Posted by Tony Williams

In 1944 the RAF Hispanos had an average stoppage rate of once in every 1,500 rounds, compared with once in about 4,500 rounds for the .50 Browning.

Tony, Thank you for the figures.
My reference collection was broken up some years ago.
So, I'm glad to see something to confirm my memories.

Kind Regards, Uyraell.

[Tony Williams]

Originally Posted by Panzerknacker

Wich is not good, and that was in 1944, after almost 4 years working in clear the "bugs" in the Birgkit gun. Unfortunately I havent see a record of the French Air force to compare.

The mounting had a lot to do with it. The Hispano was designed to be bolted to a rigid engine block, and it did not take at all kindly to being installed within more flexible wings. The wing installation on each new type of fighter had to be carefully fine-tuned. Fuselage-mounted guns were less bother, I believe.

This also affected the Browning to some extent: fixed guns were more reliable than flexibly-mounted ones.

[Panzerknacker]

Agreed, aparently in the thin wing of the Spitfire layed some of the troubles, the Typhoons gun installation seems to had a lesser rate of jamming.

[gaucho1]

Gentlemen

Thank you for a very interesting thread.
I enjoy the informed postings and pictures.
One thing I find hard to locate are terminal results of various
weapons on armor and other targets.
This thread has some outstanding pictures of these effects.
Those germans are pretty clever.

[Panzerknacker]

Thank you for a very interesting thread.
I enjoy the informed postings and pictures.
One thing I find hard to locate are terminal results of various
weapons on armor and other targets.
This thread has some outstanding pictures of these effects.

You re welcome, you re welcome, it wasnt easy to emsemble all the info but it worth the effort.

[Panzerknacker]

Cleaning up the barrel of MG 151/20. The knurled section is for easier handling when extracting it, it was a quick change one obviously.

[Panzerknacker]

Nice views the rear MG 151/20 turret, He-177.

[VonWeyer]

Very nice pics Panzerknacker.

[Panzerknacker]

Thanks, here is another.

Filling up 60 round magazines for the Ikaria Werke MG-FF 20mm gun. ( airfield in the France Campaign, 1940)

[Comrade Claus]

Are those 20mm rounds in paper sleeves? Btw, does anyone know if there are any videos of luftwaffe guns being fired online? I don't mean guncamera shots, but like ground tests.