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Thread: The Westland Whirlwind.

  1. #1
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    Post The Westland Whirlwind.

    This is yet another I shall have to dis-inter information on.
    Conceived as an escort fighter and long-range attack aircraft, this design foundered essentially because of the many problems with it's engines, two Rolls Royce Peregrines. The Peregrine was essentially an experimental and unfortunate outgrowth of the very successful RR Kestrel, which is best described as the "grandfather of the Merlin".

    The Whirlwind, had it ever been equipped with Merlin engines, would potentially have been a world-beater, well within the class of later generation fighters such as the Lockheed P38L and Ilyushin Il10.

    The aircraft was formidably armed, with up to four 20mm cannons and two Browning .303 machineguns, or 6 cannon. These were mounted in the nose of the fuselage, much as the P38 Lighting and Me.262.

    The wings were internally stressed for equipping with bomb racks for variously 4 x 250lb bombs, or 2 x 500lb bombs, or, later, 8 x 60lb rockets, much as the Typhoon.

    It's service history is less than illustrious, however, as it was only ever produced in sufficient numbers to equip two RAF Squadrons. It was employed in the ground attack/ strafing/ fighterbomber role, which it excelled at, as often as the Peregrine engines allowed.

    Other Forum members are invited to contribute to this thread on the Westland Whirlwind: these days a little-known and very much forgotten British aircraft.

    Regards, Uyraell.

    "Honi-Soit Qui Mal'Y Pense." :
    "Ill unto he who ill of it thinks."
    Edward III, Rex Britania, AD1348.

    "Wenn Schon, denn schon."
    "Be It Done, Best be It Be Done Well."
    Known German adage.

    "Until you have looked into a veteran's eyes and actually seen it,
    you'll never fully understand."
    ^Uyraell^

    "Aligaes : Amore vel Ira." :
    "^Winged Ones^ : Love or Wrath."

  2. #2
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Never heard of it as a fighter, until now...always thought it as a helicopter...at least the ones I flew in were.

    Fighter

    http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?im...%3Den%26sa%3DG

    Helicopter

    http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?im...%3Den%26sa%3DN

    http://airpower.callihan.cc/images/H...dWhirlwind.jpg
    Last edited by 32Bravo; 03-01-2009 at 07:58 AM.


    "Although God cannot alter the past, Historians can"


    Samuel Butler


  3. #3
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    I have a book called: And it was never silend. (But then in Dutch). It was produced in two parts by the airforce, and it documents all airactivety over The Netherlands from May 14 1940 untill about June 1945. In part one, it says:

    12 August 1941. Bomber Command. 87 aircraft, of wich 54 Blenheims, 12 Hampdens and 3 B-17's. Blenheims to Keulen, Hampdens to Franse, 2 B-17's to Germany and one to De Kooy (Dutch airfield near Den Helder).

    12 August 1941. Fighter Command. A squadron Whirlwinds and six squadrons Spitfires escort and support of Blenheims from Bomber Command till the Dutch coast.

    12 August 1941. Coastal Command. Photo recon. Den Haag, Leiden, Amsterdam/Schellingwoude, Haarlem, De Kooy, De Mok, Ypenburg, Schiphol, IJmuiden, Hoorn and Den Helder.

    It was the first time the B-17 apeared over Holland. It was a big day. The is an appendix with more information, following here:

    'Large attack of 2nd Group to Germany, first B-17's to The Netherlands'.

    Tuesday 12 August 1941 was the day of an attack 2 group Blenheims crews had been training for for a while. This attack was directed to Germany, two powerplants at Keulen, however, reporting is relevant as a lot of action took place in Dutch airspace. It also ment the deput of two new airplanes in our airspace. The B-17 and the Whirlwind.

    Because the Blenheims could only be escorted to just over the Dutch coast line, 5 group Hampdens would attack targeds in France. They could be escorted all the way. Also, four B-17's of 90 squadron, 2 Group, would attack the airfields of De Kooy, Emden and Keulen from high altitude.

    All in all, about 400 aircraft of the RAF would be flying that day. The attack on Keulen would be executed by 54 Blenheims, ( of 18, 21, 82, 107, 114 and 139 squadron). On the way in, comming in from the Westerschelde, they would be escorted by 12 Whirlwinds of 263 squadron and on the way back by 30 spitfires. (of 234, 152 and 66 squadron). Also, a group of 37 spitfires would conduct a fighter sweep over Zeeland. (266, 65 and 19 squadron). To ease navigation, both groups of Spitfires would be led by a Blenheim of 266 squadron.

    Take off at 10.30 (Dutch time) the low flying formation of 54 Blenheims and 12 Whirlwinds reached the Dutch coast around 11.45. Not as had been planned over the Westerschelde, but at the Harlingervliet. No German fighers were sighted, but German flak was alert and a short time after crossing the coast line the first Blenheim (of 82 squadron), was shot down by the AAA near Strijen. The escort turned back, and the 53 remaining Blenheims went on on their own. The Whrlwinds came over the Westerschelde on their way back tough, reported there by the Germans at 12.05. They came in very low, 10 to 30 meters. They wanted to attack a building they saw on the way in, but couldn't find it. So they attacked what they thought to be Flak-ships. All this when being fired upon by the AAA.

    The pilots reported 2 ships possibly destroyed, but the Germans reported no ships lost. All 12 Whirlwinds landed at 12.35 at their base, aldough some had holes of machinegun fire and flak.

    Meanewhile, in England the two groups of Spitfires had taken off and following their guides, arived shortly after 13.00 over Zeeland. They soon were engaged in dogfights with Messerschmitt Bf-109's of JG 26 and JG 1. What happened exacly is unclear, but it was a buissy half an hour over Zeeland. Around 13.15 the Blenheims returned, while from the German side, Bf-110's of ZG 76 and even some Ju-88's night fighters of I/NJG2 joined the fight. All at very low altitude, and with the partisipation of the German AAA.

    All in all, 12 Blenheims went down, 10 of the Keulen group, and 2 of 266 squadron, who had been guiding the Spitfires. Sad thing was, one of them was shot down by 109's despite the protection of 37 spitfires. He crashed into sea, and the crew was killed. The second guiding Blenheim was hit by flak, crashed near Philipinne, and this crew was also killed. This also happened to a 152 squadron spitfire, who crashed near Biervliet. Pilot also killed. A second spitfire was hit by a Bf 109, and had to crash-land near Goede. Pilot lightly wounded, and captured.

    Of the Blenheims, 5 were shot down on the way in and at the targed, and when they got back to the Dutch coast, where they were picked up by their escort, another 5 were shot down. Shot down by AAA, fighters, or both, crashed into sea. Only one, hit by AAA ditched onto sea, and the crew could get into their dinghy. They were lated picked up by a German boat and captured. (21 squadron lost 2, 18 squadron lost 3, as did 139 squadron. 114 squadron lost one and 82 squadron also one. Then there were the two guiding Blenheims of 226 squadron.)

    The Spitfires of 19 squadron claimed one Bf 109 damaged, 234 squadron one 109 and a Ju-88. Who did what is unclear, but sertan is that around 13.00 a Bf-109 of 2/JG1 had to emergensy land near Colijnsplaat, as did a night figher Ju-88 of I/NJG2, who hit the ground at Steenbergen, and of the crew, two were injured.

    While this all happened over Zeeland, 3 out of 4, (one went back to base due to technical problems) B-17's released their bombs. Pilot Officer Sturmey rapported that he had dropped his bombs at 11.00 over De Kooy, but cloud cover had prevented him from seeing the results. De Kooy raported no bombs.

    It had been a buissy day over Zeeland, not only for the RAF, but also for the Germans and the Dutch people living there.

    The Flak commander of the Vlissingen area raported that it was not easy to see who was friend and who foe. Not only because the German fighters, agains orders, flew very low, but also because the shark mouths painted onto the Bf-110's of ZG-76 gave them a totaly different look, and also the black Ju-88's were confusing. Also he reported that, aldough the shooting chances were very low, some troops could not keep calm unther the pressure of so many aircraft.

    So far the appendix.

    This was the first opperation of the Whirlwind, at least over The Netherlands, and it had not been a failure. They had attacked the Germans, aldough not destroying any ships, but still, it must have been a good day to learn from.

    According to the book, Whirlwinds were also present during the 'Channel Dash' (the break trough of 2 German warships trough the Channel from France to Germany). 137 Squadron lost that day, February 12, 1942, lost four Whirlwids.

    Another rapport, of May 27, 1942 states: Whirlwinds flew a patrol along the Dutch coast, one didn't return.

    Note: The Whirlwind was shot down by flak near IJmuiden-Beverwijk. The pilot, Flight Sergeant Brennan of 137 squadron is burried at Bergen aan Zee. The Whirlwinds had attacked the Steel factory's at IJmuiden. The factory reported about 100 hits from 2 cm guns, but no more damage.

    Apparently, where were more version's of the Whirlwind, because the raport of October 25 goes as follows: At 07.00 4 Whirlwind B's sent to shipping between Cape Griz Nez and Hoek van Holland. Nothing seigthed.

    It seems, that Whirlwind B stands for Whirlwind bomber. This was the fighterbomber version, and, just like the Hurricane, it was rapported in a different version then the normal figher.

    A lot of information, and at times a bit off topic, but I hope you all find it interesting.

    Cheers,
    Joppe

  4. #4
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Quote Originally Posted by jopped View Post
    I have a book called: And it was never silend. (But then in Dutch). It was produced in two parts by the airforce, and it documents all airactivety over The Netherlands from May 14 1940 untill about June 1945. In part one, it says:

    12 August 1941. Bomber Command. 87 aircraft, of wich 54 Blenheims, 12 Hampdens and 3 B-17's. Blenheims to Keulen, Hampdens to Franse, 2 B-17's to Germany and one to De Kooy (Dutch airfield near Den Helder).

    12 August 1941. Fighter Command. A squadron Whirlwinds and six squadrons Spitfires escort and support of Blenheims from Bomber Command till the Dutch coast.

    12 August 1941. Coastal Command. Photo recon. Den Haag, Leiden, Amsterdam/Schellingwoude, Haarlem, De Kooy, De Mok, Ypenburg, Schiphol, IJmuiden, Hoorn and Den Helder.

    It was the first time the B-17 apeared over Holland. It was a big day. The is an appendix with more information, following here:

    'Large attack of 2nd Group to Germany, first B-17's to The Netherlands'.

    Tuesday 12 August 1941 was the day of an attack 2 group Blenheims crews had been training for for a while. This attack was directed to Germany, two powerplants at Keulen, however, reporting is relevant as a lot of action took place in Dutch airspace. It also ment the deput of two new airplanes in our airspace. The B-17 and the Whirlwind.

    Because the Blenheims could only be escorted to just over the Dutch coast line, 5 group Hampdens would attack targeds in France. They could be escorted all the way. Also, four B-17's of 90 squadron, 2 Group, would attack the airfields of De Kooy, Emden and Keulen from high altitude.

    All in all, about 400 aircraft of the RAF would be flying that day. The attack on Keulen would be executed by 54 Blenheims, ( of 18, 21, 82, 107, 114 and 139 squadron). On the way in, comming in from the Westerschelde, they would be escorted by 12 Whirlwinds of 263 squadron and on the way back by 30 spitfires. (of 234, 152 and 66 squadron). Also, a group of 37 spitfires would conduct a fighter sweep over Zeeland. (266, 65 and 19 squadron). To ease navigation, both groups of Spitfires would be led by a Blenheim of 266 squadron.

    Take off at 10.30 (Dutch time) the low flying formation of 54 Blenheims and 12 Whirlwinds reached the Dutch coast around 11.45. Not as had been planned over the Westerschelde, but at the Harlingervliet. No German fighers were sighted, but German flak was alert and a short time after crossing the coast line the first Blenheim (of 82 squadron), was shot down by the AAA near Strijen. The escort turned back, and the 53 remaining Blenheims went on on their own. The Whrlwinds came over the Westerschelde on their way back tough, reported there by the Germans at 12.05. They came in very low, 10 to 30 meters. They wanted to attack a building they saw on the way in, but couldn't find it. So they attacked what they thought to be Flak-ships. All this when being fired upon by the AAA.

    The pilots reported 2 ships possibly destroyed, but the Germans reported no ships lost. All 12 Whirlwinds landed at 12.35 at their base, aldough some had holes of machinegun fire and flak.

    Meanewhile, in England the two groups of Spitfires had taken off and following their guides, arived shortly after 13.00 over Zeeland. They soon were engaged in dogfights with Messerschmitt Bf-109's of JG 26 and JG 1. What happened exacly is unclear, but it was a buissy half an hour over Zeeland. Around 13.15 the Blenheims returned, while from the German side, Bf-110's of ZG 76 and even some Ju-88's night fighters of I/NJG2 joined the fight. All at very low altitude, and with the partisipation of the German AAA.

    All in all, 12 Blenheims went down, 10 of the Keulen group, and 2 of 266 squadron, who had been guiding the Spitfires. Sad thing was, one of them was shot down by 109's despite the protection of 37 spitfires. He crashed into sea, and the crew was killed. The second guiding Blenheim was hit by flak, crashed near Philipinne, and this crew was also killed. This also happened to a 152 squadron spitfire, who crashed near Biervliet. Pilot also killed. A second spitfire was hit by a Bf 109, and had to crash-land near Goede. Pilot lightly wounded, and captured.

    Of the Blenheims, 5 were shot down on the way in and at the targed, and when they got back to the Dutch coast, where they were picked up by their escort, another 5 were shot down. Shot down by AAA, fighters, or both, crashed into sea. Only one, hit by AAA ditched onto sea, and the crew could get into their dinghy. They were lated picked up by a German boat and captured. (21 squadron lost 2, 18 squadron lost 3, as did 139 squadron. 114 squadron lost one and 82 squadron also one. Then there were the two guiding Blenheims of 226 squadron.)

    The Spitfires of 19 squadron claimed one Bf 109 damaged, 234 squadron one 109 and a Ju-88. Who did what is unclear, but sertan is that around 13.00 a Bf-109 of 2/JG1 had to emergensy land near Colijnsplaat, as did a night figher Ju-88 of I/NJG2, who hit the ground at Steenbergen, and of the crew, two were injured.

    While this all happened over Zeeland, 3 out of 4, (one went back to base due to technical problems) B-17's released their bombs. Pilot Officer Sturmey rapported that he had dropped his bombs at 11.00 over De Kooy, but cloud cover had prevented him from seeing the results. De Kooy raported no bombs.

    It had been a buissy day over Zeeland, not only for the RAF, but also for the Germans and the Dutch people living there.

    The Flak commander of the Vlissingen area raported that it was not easy to see who was friend and who foe. Not only because the German fighters, agains orders, flew very low, but also because the shark mouths painted onto the Bf-110's of ZG-76 gave them a totaly different look, and also the black Ju-88's were confusing. Also he reported that, aldough the shooting chances were very low, some troops could not keep calm unther the pressure of so many aircraft.

    So far the appendix.

    This was the first opperation of the Whirlwind, at least over The Netherlands, and it had not been a failure. They had attacked the Germans, aldough not destroying any ships, but still, it must have been a good day to learn from.

    According to the book, Whirlwinds were also present during the 'Channel Dash' (the break trough of 2 German warships trough the Channel from France to Germany). 137 Squadron lost that day, February 12, 1942, lost four Whirlwids.

    Another rapport, of May 27, 1942 states: Whirlwinds flew a patrol along the Dutch coast, one didn't return.

    Note: The Whirlwind was shot down by flak near IJmuiden-Beverwijk. The pilot, Flight Sergeant Brennan of 137 squadron is burried at Bergen aan Zee. The Whirlwinds had attacked the Steel factory's at IJmuiden. The factory reported about 100 hits from 2 cm guns, but no more damage.

    Apparently, where were more version's of the Whirlwind, because the raport of October 25 goes as follows: At 07.00 4 Whirlwind B's sent to shipping between Cape Griz Nez and Hoek van Holland. Nothing seigthed.

    It seems, that Whirlwind B stands for Whirlwind bomber. This was the fighterbomber version, and, just like the Hurricane, it was rapported in a different version then the normal figher.

    A lot of information, and at times a bit off topic, but I hope you all find it interesting.

    Cheers,
    Joppe
    Many, Many. Thanks, Joppe

    I have almost no ''in action" data on the Whirlwind, these days. My book collection was destroyed. I still have the dimensional data, and similar details, along with minor information on the aircraft at war. Am glad to see this information you've shared.

    Regards, Uyraell.
    Last edited by Uyraell; 03-01-2009 at 11:10 AM.

    "Honi-Soit Qui Mal'Y Pense." :
    "Ill unto he who ill of it thinks."
    Edward III, Rex Britania, AD1348.

    "Wenn Schon, denn schon."
    "Be It Done, Best be It Be Done Well."
    Known German adage.

    "Until you have looked into a veteran's eyes and actually seen it,
    you'll never fully understand."
    ^Uyraell^

    "Aligaes : Amore vel Ira." :
    "^Winged Ones^ : Love or Wrath."

  5. #5
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Quote Originally Posted by 32Bravo View Post
    Never heard of it as a fighter, until now...always thought it as a helicopter...at least the ones I flew in were.

    Fighter

    http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?im...%3Den%26sa%3DG

    Helicopter

    http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?im...%3Den%26sa%3DN

    http://airpower.callihan.cc/images/H...dWhirlwind.jpg
    Which is in part why I began this thread.
    These days the helicopter is barely remembered.
    The airplane is even less known.
    Since it did serve in WW2, I thought it worth a mention, where, for example the Bristol Brigand or the DH Sea Hornet is not, despite that they are also WW2 designs.

    Also, for the first few post-war years (roughly 20), the British were far from imaginative or creative where naming new models of aircraft was concerned. Several times names were re-employed even though relating to very different aircraft.

    The Helicopter you flew as a Whirlwind doesn't exactly class as "British" in design either.
    The prototype Sikorsky 51 was demonstrated in the UK, and Type Approved for purchase for Armed Forces use. Subsequently, the UK govt insisted on Licenced Production in the UK, thus Westland enters the scene. As usual, the UK govt delayed the purchase so long that the S51 had meanwhile evolved via the S53 into the S55, which is what the UK govt ended up purchasing, carrying the Whirlwind name over from what had been intended to be the S51 name in UK service. In effect recycling the name "Whirlwind" for the third time.

    At this remove in time from my childhood years (I was about 9 when I read all the above) I may have committed to writing minor inaccuracies, but the story as far as the helicopter Whirlwind is basically factual as I've put here, and as far as my memory allows.

    Regards, Uyraell.
    Last edited by Uyraell; 03-01-2009 at 11:08 AM.

    "Honi-Soit Qui Mal'Y Pense." :
    "Ill unto he who ill of it thinks."
    Edward III, Rex Britania, AD1348.

    "Wenn Schon, denn schon."
    "Be It Done, Best be It Be Done Well."
    Known German adage.

    "Until you have looked into a veteran's eyes and actually seen it,
    you'll never fully understand."
    ^Uyraell^

    "Aligaes : Amore vel Ira." :
    "^Winged Ones^ : Love or Wrath."

  6. #6
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Fit Merlin engines, and you need to re-do a lot of the development work to match engines and airframe. Do that and you end up with the De Haviland Hornet, a truly formidable aircraft but one which wasn't operational until 1945 - and then only barely. Just fitting new engines is rarely a simple process, and it is questionable what role such an aircraft would have performed better than existing aircraft - and if this is a good use of scarce resources in wartime.
    I have neither the time nor the inclination to differentiate between the incompetent and the merely unfortunate - Curtis E LeMay

  7. #7
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Quote Originally Posted by pdf27 View Post
    Fit Merlin engines, and you need to re-do a lot of the development work...Just fitting new engines is rarely a simple process, and it is questionable what role such an aircraft would have performed better than existing aircraft - and if this is a good use of scarce resources in wartime.

    Especially when it's a twin engined aircraft...

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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Interesting aircraft, I got a little book about. lll post a little more later.

  9. #9
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    Post Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Quote Originally Posted by pdf27 View Post
    Fit Merlin engines, and you need to re-do a lot of the development work to match engines and airframe. Do that and you end up with the De Haviland Hornet, a truly formidable aircraft but one which wasn't operational until 1945 - and then only barely. Just fitting new engines is rarely a simple process, and it is questionable what role such an aircraft would have performed better than existing aircraft - and if this is a good use of scarce resources in wartime.
    Very true. What always struck me as curious though, was that AEE Farnborough took a P40 (effectively the same generation, in design terms) and contrived to fit increased span wings, with a Merlin on each `a la Whirlwind with Peregrines. Not unnaturally, a sort of bastardised P40/Whirlwind was the result. Perhaps surprisingly, the P40-Twin flew well, though they never ascribed a role for it.

    Thus, having produced a twin Merlin aircraft smaller than a Beaufighter or Mosquito, they had the preliminary work in essence complete, for a Merlin-Whirlwind.

    Which is more or less where the DH Hornet enters the scene. The P40-Twin was one of the contributory aircraft that provided data towards the Hornet, along with the Merlin-Beaufighters, and the Mosquito.

    Thus, though the point about wartime resources is well made, a certain rather curious usage of those resources is demonstrated. Much of the thinking on that prompted this thread.

    Regards, Uyraell.
    Last edited by Uyraell; 03-02-2009 at 07:26 AM.

    "Honi-Soit Qui Mal'Y Pense." :
    "Ill unto he who ill of it thinks."
    Edward III, Rex Britania, AD1348.

    "Wenn Schon, denn schon."
    "Be It Done, Best be It Be Done Well."
    Known German adage.

    "Until you have looked into a veteran's eyes and actually seen it,
    you'll never fully understand."
    ^Uyraell^

    "Aligaes : Amore vel Ira." :
    "^Winged Ones^ : Love or Wrath."

  10. #10
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    Smile Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Quote Originally Posted by Panzerknacker View Post
    Interesting aircraft, I got a little book about. lll post a little more later.
    My friend, anything you can contribute will be worth the read.
    And I shall be glad to see it.

    Warm Regards, and Thank you in advance,

    Uyraell.

    "Honi-Soit Qui Mal'Y Pense." :
    "Ill unto he who ill of it thinks."
    Edward III, Rex Britania, AD1348.

    "Wenn Schon, denn schon."
    "Be It Done, Best be It Be Done Well."
    Known German adage.

    "Until you have looked into a veteran's eyes and actually seen it,
    you'll never fully understand."
    ^Uyraell^

    "Aligaes : Amore vel Ira." :
    "^Winged Ones^ : Love or Wrath."

  11. #11
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    Especially when it's a twin engined aircraft...
    You're both correct.
    The curious history of the aircraft is one reason I began the thread.
    The fact that it could have been, and could have achieved so much more, is another reason.

    Warm Regards, Uyraell.

    "Honi-Soit Qui Mal'Y Pense." :
    "Ill unto he who ill of it thinks."
    Edward III, Rex Britania, AD1348.

    "Wenn Schon, denn schon."
    "Be It Done, Best be It Be Done Well."
    Known German adage.

    "Until you have looked into a veteran's eyes and actually seen it,
    you'll never fully understand."
    ^Uyraell^

    "Aligaes : Amore vel Ira." :
    "^Winged Ones^ : Love or Wrath."

  12. #12
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    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Hi. Today, I took the second part of my book, it going from june 1943 till the end of the war. Here is what it says:

    14/15 june 1943, Fighter Command. 16 Mosquito's, 8 Beaufighters, 6 Whirlwinds, 6 Mustangs, 3 Typhoon B's, and a Boston were sent out for Intruder opp's over France and the Low Coutries. Results: A Mosquito attacked targeds in the Netherlands, damaging two trains and two river ships. A Beaufighter shot down a Bf-110 and also reported that another German aircraft was shot down by their own AAA.

    Note: 40 aircraft were used by fighter command for intruder opp's, and aldough all types of aircraft had done this before, now for the first time Beaufighters with radar on board were used. In responce of the losses of Bomber Command during night raids, it had now been alowed for these night fighters to opperate in enemy teretory, especialy to hunt down the German night fighters. To do this, they had the 'normal' AI radar, and the 'Serrate', a radar that responded to the German night fighter radar from a range up to 150 km.

    Of the 8 used Beaufighters, six had radar equipment. They were from 141 squadron, normaly stationed at Wittering, but for this night they opperated from Coltishall. Wing Commander Braham, the squadron CO, claimed the Bf-110 at 02.30, the fighter going down in flames, and crashing in a great ball of fire on the north east shore of the Zuiderzee, north of Stavoren.

    The German raports do not state the loss of a Bf-110 in the area, they did rapport a crash landing of a Bf-110 on Gilze-Rijen, due to engine troubles by enemy fire. This one was from I/NJG1, a second Bf-110 of II/NJG1 was shot down over Germany by a Lancaster. They also didn't rapport the shooting down of a German aircraft by their own flak, but they did report two Lancasters being downed in the area, one at 01.44 by a night fighter, 3 km east of Deelen, another at 02.30, near Renkum. Of the 204 Lancasters of Bomber Command on opp's this night, 17 did not return to base. One of them was DV160, 460 RAAF squadron, shot down by a German night fighter near Schellingwouden. One engine of this aircraft was recovered by the Dutch airforce in 1978 and now rests in the Soesterberg Airforce Museum.

    15/16 August 1943. Fighter Command. 27 Mosquito's, 8 Beaufighters, 7 Typhoons an 4 Mustangs for intruder opps. Over the Netherlands railroads were attacked, and bombs dropped at De Kooy airfield. One Typhoon didn't return from this opp.

    3 Whirlwind B's and 6 Hurricane with rockeds were sent out for anti shipping opperations between Walcheren and Northern France, nothing special to report.

    Note: The Typhoon lost was of 195 squadron, who, according to the German raport, crashed at 03.00 2 km north east of Bergen airfield. The pilot was blinded by search lights. Pilot Officer Webster lost his life.

    In the night of 17/18 August 1943, there is another mentioning of the Whirlwind in nightly anti shipping opperations, but again nothing special to report.

    These last opp's with the Whirlwind must have been carried out by 263 squadron, as 137 squadron seizer operating them in June of 1943. They got Hurricane Mk IV's for a while, before they got Typhoon's. (link: http://www.rafweb.org/Sqn136-140.htm )

    263 squadron traided in their aircraft for the Typhoon in December 1943. (link: http://www.rafweb.org/Sqn261-265.htm )

    Cheers,
    Joppe

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    210

    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    don't forget that the Whirlwind was conceived at the same time as the Spitfire and the Hurricane. At that time 1937/38, it was, in effect, superior to the other two. The fact that it used Kesteral engines was considered a problem. It was seen in the same way as the ME110, in that it was to be a bomber protecter.

    Considering the modifications that were needed to made to the Spitfire over its service, one can't really knock the lovely Whirlwind for falling behind the opposition. And the biggest hinderance to the aircraft being given Merlins wasn't design issues but the fact that Bomber Command kept blocking Merlin engines being diverted away from their bombers. The only two engined aircraft they pushed for was the Mosquito, and even then they weren't happy about its use by non-BC squadrons.

    But I still prefer the Beaufighter
    _______________________________________________

    Squadron Leader Mahinder Singh Pujji DFC - 43 & 258 Squadron RAF & 6 Squadron RIAF. Hurricanes & Spitfires over France, Tomahawks in North Africa, Hurricanes over Burma.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    South West
    Posts
    953

    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    A later development along the lines of the Whirlwind 'I have read that it was a later development from the whirlwind idea' was the Westland Welkin developed around 42/43

    Not got much actual info except a test pilots short report on it

    A High altitude twin engined fighter using R/R Merlin engines

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Cordoba-Argentina
    Posts
    6,392

    Default Re: The Westland Whirlwind.

    Good reports Jopped, wasnt it used also covering the Dieppe Landings ?

    My friend, anything you can contribute will be worth the read.
    And I shall be glad to see it.

    Here you got, nice litte heavy fighter, demolishing firepower, tough a bit slow.











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