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Thread: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

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  1. #1
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    Default Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Japan not WWII aggressor, says air force chief
    Posted Sat Nov 1, 2008 12:25am AEDT

    Japan's air force chief has released an essay saying that the nation was not the aggressor in World War II, in comments likely to anger Asian neighbours.

    The essay was authored by General Toshio Tamogami, chief of staff of Japan's Air Self-Defence Force, and won the top award in an inaugural contest aimed at describing "true views of modern history."

    "Even now, there are many people who think that our country's 'aggression' caused unbearable suffering to the countries of Asia during the Greater East Asia War," said the English-language version of the essay.

    "But we need to realise that many Asian countries take a positive view of the Greater East Asia War," it said.

    "In Thailand, Burma, India, Singapore, and Indonesia, the Japan that fought the Greater East Asia War is held in high esteem," it said.

    "It is certainly a false accusation to say that our country was an aggressor nation."

    The Greater East Asia War was a term used by Japan to describe the conflict in the Asia-Pacific theatre, emphasising that it involved Asian nations seeking independence from the Western powers.

    The essay, entitled "Was Japan an Aggressor Nation?," was posted on the website of a Japanese hotel chain which organised the contest.

    Mr Tamogami argued that Japan was drawn into World War II by then US president Franklin D Roosevelt, whom he said was being manipulated by the Comintern.

    Mr Tamogami also rejected the verdicts of an Allied tribunal which convicted Japanese wartime leaders as war criminals after Tokyo's defeat in 1945.

    The thesis also runs counter to a 1995 statement issued by then prime minister Tomiichi Murayama and endorsed by his successors, which apologised for Japan's past aggression and colonial rule in Asia.

    The statement acknowledged that Japan, through its colonial rule and aggression, "caused tremendous damage and suffering to the people of many countries, particularly to those of Asian nations."

    But there has been a persistent nationalistic argument in Japan that the Murayama statement was part of the country's "masochism" aimed at accommodating Asian neighbours.

    Japan renounced the right to wage war after World War II and calls its de facto military the Self-Defence Forces.
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...01/2407454.htm


    If Japan wasn't the aggressor in WWII, I'd hate to see what would have happened if it was.

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    That´s what happens if an education system doesn´t allow an uninfluenced view on important parts of national history.

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Quote Originally Posted by tom! View Post
    That´s what happens if an education system doesn´t allow an uninfluenced view on important parts of national history.
    I doubt that the issue of corrupted civilian war education has much to do with General Tamogami's essay as he would, one expects, be rather better informed as a professional and very senior military officer about the realities of Japan's war. Unless, of course, military education about WWII is as badly corrupted as civilian education, which is more disturbing.

    What is even more disturbing is that he might reflect the same sort of denials and nationalism in the military which has infected Japan's conservative civilian leaders for much of the post war period.

    I'd like to see an impartial translation of his essay as the press and others often sensationalise aspects of such things.

    While Japan has been exceptional in its perversion of its WWII history, it's a long way from being the only country to present a perverted or distorted view of its own history to its own people. No nation has clean hands in that area.

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    This is not a very good political move.
    For one, the Air-Self Defence Force is very much the biggest US ally of that reigion (maybe except for Korea) and you do stuff for/with the US and other Asian Nations all the time. Were pulling out of Iraq but we do PKOs in other places. This crap will not cause very good perceptions for those countries and the US.
    I hope he renounces the statement.... for his own career's sake.

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Walter Schmidt View Post
    I hope he renounces the statement.... for his own career's sake.
    Wouldn't help if he did - he was fired so fast his feet didn't touch the ground.
    I have neither the time nor the inclination to differentiate between the incompetent and the merely unfortunate - Curtis E LeMay

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Quote Originally Posted by pdf27 View Post
    Wouldn't help if he did - he was fired so fast his feet didn't touch the ground.
    I can see that.

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Let's face it his ideas and thoughts about Japan's involvement in WW 2 are shared by many other Japanese, as scary as that seems.
    Just compare it to how Germany or Italy feels about their part in WW 2,and for the most part its a whole lot more realistic.
    IMHO Japan got off way too easy on their war crimes and that has led to the what alot of them feel about their actions in WW 2.

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Quote Originally Posted by Django View Post
    Let's face it his ideas and thoughts about Japan's involvement in WW 2 are shared by many other Japanese, as scary as that seems.
    Just compare it to how Germany or Italy feels about their part in WW 2,and for the most part its a whole lot more realistic.
    Embarrassement, humiliation, scorn. These three adjectives coming from a nation, Germany, who not only lost but divided four times by the allied powers. Italy, on the other hand, did not suffer as much at the hands of the allied powers mostly because changed sides in 1943 and allowed to quickly join NATO. Japan was occupied by American forces until the 1960s.

  9. #9
    kurt Guest

    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Quote Originally Posted by Django View Post
    Let's face it his ideas and thoughts about Japan's involvement in WW 2 are shared by many other Japanese, as scary as that seems.
    Just compare it to how Germany or Italy feels about their part in WW 2,and for the most part its a whole lot more realistic.
    IMHO Japan got off way too easy on their war crimes and that has led to the what alot of them feel about their actions in WW 2.
    In an Australian "World Socialist Web Site" I found a very interesting article about WWII in general and regarding the Pacific War there is a quite different point of view about the background of that war, I'm aware this is a leftist source and I don't share many of their opinions, but they talk about an Orange Plan devised in the US to wage war against Japan, at least for me, this is completely new:

    Plans for a war against Japan were under active consideration in the US long before Pearl Harbour. In March 1939, the US Navy distributed a revision to its war plan called Basic War Plan ORANGE. Orange stood for Japan. According to the plan, war with ORANGE would be “precipitated without notice” and would be an offensive war of “long duration”. The aim of the war plan was “to impose the will of the United States upon ORANGE by destroying ORANGE Armed Forces and by disrupting ORANGE economic life, while protecting American interests at home and abroad.” [3]

    In September 1940, the American naval attaché in Tokyo sent a report to Washington about the state of Japanese cities. “Hoses are old, worn and leaky,” he wrote, “water mains are shut off at night. Little pressure is available. Fire hydrants are few and far between. … Incendiary bombs sowed widely over an area of Japanese cities would result in the destruction of major portions of those cities.” [4] This advice was put into deadly effect in March 1945 with the firebombing of Tokyo. More than 100,000 people are estimated to have died in the ensuing firestorm; more than the immediate deaths resulting from the atomic bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

    http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/no...nbww-n18.shtml

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Quote Originally Posted by kurt View Post
    but they talk about an Orange Plan devised in the US to wage war against Japan, at least for me, this is completely new
    1. Everyone with modest knowledge of WWII knows about Orange and its variants, which have been discussed at length on this site.

    2. Orange was a defensive response to an anticipated attack by Japan.

    3. Japan attacked and started the war.

    4. Your attempts at trolling are patent and tiresome.
    ..
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  11. #11
    kurt Guest

    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    I'm sorry for my modest knowledge of WWII, I'm trying to improve it, in doing so, I found this interesting information too:

    Until 1939, the US government followed a pattern of conflicting policies regarding China and Japan. Committed on the one hand to an Open Door Policy toward China, the US conversely recognized in 1908 and again in 1917 that Japan had special rights and interest in eastern Asia because of its "territorial propinquity." The Lansing-Ishii Agreement of 1917, in fact, specifically recognized Japan's special position in Manchuria and on the Shantung Peninsula. Moreover, until 1941 the US consistently supplied Japan with the war materials necessary to undertake and sustain operations not only against China but against the Netherlands and France as well. At the same time, the United States maintained a naval rivalry with Japan which, because of various factors, had already begun to tilt in Japan's favor following the end of World War I

    http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...lan-orange.htm

    Since I presume you are from Australia I was looking for an opinion about WSWS as a credible source. But it looks like if anything that disturb your opinion is regarded as "trolling".

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    I looked in deeper with this but this is only one person, and is not the view of most Japanese military personell or citizen, outside of a military hobby shop.
    Also, this guy was not kicked but used a somewhat complicated political manouver to actualy retire, not get kicked. The administration is trying to do something about that right now.

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    I wonder if the good Japanese General ever heard of Area 31, the base in China where experiments were performed using toxic gasses and chemicals on POWs to practice for large spread use of gas and chemicals in Asia. Of course, the commandant of the base was taken to the USA where he was given a large pension for his data and expertise on the subject.
    In addition, I wonder if the good Japanese general ever heard of the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere that in effect would be "eight corners of the world under one roof."
    That one roof would be Japan.
    IMHO, his revisionism is a WWII war crime.
    Where's Major Kong?

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Regardless of apologies made, which I believe have been made to appease certain nations, including the US, rather than actual remorse, I could hardly call any such comments actual revisionism on the Japanese officer's part, at least not in his own view. This is the way that many Japanese, military or civilian, feel about their actions during WW2. Revisionism implies that the general consensus about a historical event has been wrong and needs to be changed with the actual facts. While we may have shared such consensus regarding Japan's involvement, the Japanese haven't. He may have been "punished" for his comments, but I would suspect that this was so because it again places Japan in a spotlight that they'd rather avoid and not because his fellow Japanese think that what he said was wrong.

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    Default Re: Japanese Revisionism: Latest episode

    Quote Originally Posted by Rising Sun* View Post
    Mr Tamogami argued that Japan was drawn into World War II by then US president Franklin D Roosevelt, whom he said was being manipulated by the Comintern.

    .
    Oh this is something new
    The President Roosewelt was being manipulated by.....Commintern.
    What a fascinating idea.
    OK so it was Rooswelt who draw the the Japane into the WW2.
    For god sake, what force has pushed the Japs to the ..China in 1920yy ( Long long time BEFOR Rooswelt even become the president)
    What was that invisible force that make poor Japs to commite the genocide in China and Mongolia ?
    Evil Zionist or Soviet commies?
    Which one?

    "I decide who is a Jew and who is an Aryan "- Hermann Goering

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