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Thread: U-Boote Typ XX1

  1. #1

    Default U-Boote Typ XX1

    Hey fellas just askin the question dose any1 know who designed the XXI uboat, and what the dive time for it was
    Last edited by Doddssy1; 06-22-2007 at 04:55 AM. Reason: spelling mistake

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  3. #3

    Default U-Boot references


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    Default U-boten

    i have read something on u boats that some surrenderd in 1946 in south america, now is this true if so i wouls like to get more info as im expieriencing that this info i hard to find


    also sorry for the spelling as it was suposed to be U-Boote (thanks walther)
    Mustard pie
    Last edited by Mustard Pie; 06-30-2007 at 01:10 PM.

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    Nah, it's rubbish.

    Some surrendered en route to Japan. But a U-Boat of the time could not have operated too long after the surrender of Germany. Certainly not until 1946.
    If you post idiocy, don't get upset if you are seen as an idiot.... I don't.

    Here endth the lesson.




    Have you seen any combat?

    Seen a little on TV.

    You talk the talk, but do you walk the walk?



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    One of the best sites on the internet for U-boots

    http://www.uboat.net/boats/listing.html

    101st Airborne

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    Also correct your spelling:

    It is "U-Boote" (plural of U-Boot) and not "U-Boten" a "Bote" is a male messenger (male plural: " die Boten", female singular " die Botin", female plural: " die Botinnen")

    Jan

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    ah i thought so and thanks for that link to that should keep me bizzy for a while.

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    I have no facts but did hear of atleast one Uboat that was outfitted with the new snorkle fleeing to south america spending the whole trip underwater but being turned over once they got to south america but not in 1946. Again no facts to support it, sorry. I hope it helps.

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    i have read something on u boats that some surrenderd in 1946 in south america, now is this true if so i wouls like to get more info as im expieriencing that this info i hard to find

    Two submarines come to the Argentinian shore in late 1945 but no in 1946. Those were U-977 and U-530.

    On 10 May, 1945 U-977, in Norwegian waters when Germany surrendered, put ashore those men who did not wish to accompany the rest of the crew on a desperate voyage to Argentina.

    Surrender in Argentina in August, 1945

    The boat left Kristiansand, Norway on 2 May, 1945 for a combat patrol in the English Channel. When Germany surrendered a few days later the boat was outbound in Norwegian waters. After deciding to head for Argentina Schäffer gave the married men on board the chance to go to shore. Roughly a third of the crew, 16 men, opted for the shore and were put on land on 10 May near Holsenöy in dinghies. They all ended up in British hands. U-977 then sailed for Argentina; from May 10 to July 14 the voyage was a 66-day continuous submerged Schnorchel run, the second longest in the war (after U-978's 68 days).

    The journey was extremely difficult for the crew and many were apparently on the edge of a nervous breakdown. The boat stopped in Cape Verde Islands for a short swim break and then headed south on the surface using one diesel. Crossing the equator on July 23 she arrived in Mar del Plata, Argentina on 17 August for a total patrol length of 108 days. The commander, Heinz Schäffer, published a book in 1952 called U-boat 977 about his journey.
    And that bring the histeria, some guys saw Hitler and Eva landing after this

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    I have a copy of the book U-boat 977 it is very good as for 977 it ended the war on or about August 17th 1945. It took them 3.5 months to get there after they decided to head to Argentina from Norway on the 2ed of May 1945...

    Also for people really interested please read "Submarines Of World War Two" by ERMINIO BAGNASCO

    Or

    "U-977 The Boat That Escaped To Argentina" by HEINZ SCHAEFFER

    As to the type XXI DEVELOPEMENT Here it is......

    U-Boot Type XXI in Detail

    The Boat That Changed the Submarine Warfare

    In the spring of 1943, Germany was clearly losing the battle of the Atlantic. Improvements in Allied escort material and tactics, combined with cracking the German military code dramatically increased the U-Boats´ losses, rendering them near useless. The German high command saw its best reaction in the speedy development of improved submarines. These were meant to overcome the shortcomings of the current types VII and IX, especially their low speed and little underwater endurance. A future submarine would have to be fast, silent and able to operate submerged for any given time to evade enemy aircraft.

    In the long run, the Germans saw their biggest potential in a propulsion independent from surface air, made possible by the Walter turbine (we aircraft modellers know Mr. Walter for his RATO pods used to bolster the thrust of German aircraft on take-off). It utilised Hydrogen peroxide as fuel; this system would give the boat a hitherto impossible underwater speed of more than 20 knots, yet only limited range.

    Two submarine hulls were in the developing stage that would make use of the system. The larger one, the Type XVIII, was designed for long-range operations. It combined a diesel-electric powerplant for long-range duty (getting into the operations area and back) with a Walter turbine (for underwater attack use only). Thus, the hull grew rather large, yet was designed with a streamlined perfection hitherto unknown. The smaller craft, the Type XXII, would be used near the shore and was much smaller.

    The project was delayed by the complicated and largely untested power plant: It was felt that it would take several years for it to achieve sufficient reliability for combat use. Moreover, the current production of Hydrogen peroxide was much too small for the projected needs of a large submarine fleet; so adequate capacities would have to be built up beforehand.
    Last edited by 50gunship; 07-18-2007 at 11:45 PM. Reason: readability issues

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    The Advent of the Elektroboot

    In this situation in the spring of 1943, with dozens of boats lost to Allied forces, as an interim solution it was decided to mate the hulls of the projected Walter boats with conventional powerplants, although with three times the battery capacity than hitherto. This were the types XXI and XXIII which should help turn the tide of the war. Until their deployment, the current types, successively equipped with snorkels, had to soldier on despite staggering losses and somehow bind Allied forces.

    The Type XXI was a bigger boat than the Type VII; it was well designed and resembled in no way a stopgap construction. The new boat's hull was designed for high underwater speeds; its shape reflected a change in design: All earlier submarines had essentially been surface vessels that submerged for short spells - this would be a real submarine for the first time. The streamlined shape of the hull and the conning tower produced less noise and made detection by acoustics harder. Moreover, the engines´ efficiency was nearly doubled, giving the Type XXI a top submerged speed of nearly 18 knots for short periods of time.

    The vessel's detectability by Sonar or ASDIC could not be altogether eliminated, but in the event it turned out that the new boats were much harder to detect than their predecessors on account of their optimised shape and silent engines. They were also able to sail much faster in silent mode than hitherto.

    Six bow torpedo tubes were installed, none at the stern. The boat carried ample spare torpedoes - sufficient for two rechargings in a very short time (20 minutes). Only two twin 20 mm AA guns were mounted in streamlined fairings on the sail, otherwise the boat carried no guns. The sail in its final configuration had only a very small open "bridge", rather hatches only, a total change in design in comparison with the earlier types. It just was not meant to sail on the surface any more. A snorkel system allowed for virtually unlimited operations below the surface, recharging batteries and sailing submerged under diesel power.

    An improved passive and active sonar system, called Gruppenhorchgerät and Unterwasser-Ortungsgerät NIBELUNG respectively, enabled detection and attack of enemy shipping without optical contact - another revolutionary feature introduced with the type. Theoretically, the bow-mounted passive sonar would detect enemy shipping and enable the boat to close in near enough for the use of the active sonar. Only a few of its impulses should suffice to compute the distance, speed and bearing of the target with more than sufficient precision for use with the improved LUT-torpedoes. LUT, standing for Lageunabhängiger Torpedo was a new type of guided torpedo to be fired regardless of the target's bearing that would steer an interception course programmed by the torpedo computer. The probability of hits on targets longer than 60 meters was calculated at 95 %.

    Crew facilities - though still spartan - were better compared to earlier types. Most crew members had their own bunks (51 for 58 hands); the boat was air-conditioned and equipped with freezers for supplies, thus markedly improving the crew's situation. There were three toilets and a fresh water distiller that increased personal hygiene and crew comfort vastly.

    Production and Operations

    This design was completed and executed under conditions typical for the second half of the war - the Allied strategic bombing campaign. To evade it, the construction office was housed in a remote location in the Hartz mountains; the boats were built decentralized in modules, which were ferried by barge to a main site only towards the end of construction. Here they were assembled to complete hulls, reducing the period of vulnerability towards air attacks in the shipyard. This system was of course vulnerable, too: Raids on a certain manufacturer could halt progress on all three yards that did the final assembly.

    Total construction time compared to former methods was reduced from 22 months to only 9, and that was all that counted in the given situation.
    In the end, the overly optimistic schedules weren't met due to the deteriorating war situation and the teething troubles inevitable in such a complex design; but a full 119 Type XXI were completed and delivered in less than a year (28 June 1944 until May 1945).

    Only a single(Other sources say two or three made sorties which is possible) Type XXI boat was operationally deployed towards the end of the war. It did not fire a single shot in anger, yet the few encounters made by U 2511 on its raid from Norway between 30 April and 4 May, 1945 showed the Allies´ inability to track the boat with their equipment.

    22 Type XXIs were destroyed by the Allies in the yards, 84 were scuttled by their crews following Admiral Doenitz's orders from May 4th, 1945.

    However, 12 vessels fell into Allied hands intact and gave valuable impulses towards post-war submarine development, both on the eastern and the western side. Major post-war submarine constructions in the Soviet Union, the UK, France and the USA were visibly influenced by the Type XXI.

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    Technical information for type XXI

    Displacement: (tons) 1621 (sf) 1819 (sm) 2100 (total)
    Length: (m) 76,70 oa 60,50 ph
    Beam: (m) 8,00 oa 5,30 ph
    Draught: (draft) 6,32 m
    Height: 11,30 m
    Power: (hp) 4000 (sf) 4400 (sm)

    Speed: (knots) 15,6 (sf) 17,2 (sm)
    Range: (miles / knots) 15500/10 (sf)
    340/5 (sm)
    Torpedoes: 23 6/0 (bow / stern tubes)
    Mines: 12 TMC stored in torpedo tubes
    Deck gun: No deck gun
    Crew: 57-60 men
    Max depth: ca. 280 m
    (919 feet)

    sm = submerged, sf = surfaced, ph = pressure hull,
    oa = overall, hp = horsepower.
    Last edited by 50gunship; 07-18-2007 at 08:58 PM.

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    I thought i might include a list (though not after over a year) is not fully complete or details filled in.

    Epilogue:
    Key
    (Type Of Boat)
    (Year)
    (Note) (Description Here)
    Notes: “Never Built” Means this boat was just a plan and was never started. “Never Completed” Means were either given production numbers and or were started and then scraped and canceled/ Never completed before end of war. “Not Delivered” Means was ordered by another country but not delivered.

    The U-boat projects of Marineamt (MA) and K-Amt (As far as I was able to discover them) 1933– 1945

    I-A
    (1936) Hochsee-Tauchboot (Highsea Diveboat)

    Ocean going boat (based on the Turkish "Gür") which had been constructed by German U-boat development bureau at Cadiz.

    Only two were built and both were almost uncontrollable - even in calm seas.

    The crews of U 25 and U 26 had to be extremely careful and alert!
    When making crach dives, the I A had the habit of going unstable, wobbling sideways. And it had to be carefully levelled off to make sure it would stay at required depth. Another dangerous problem was to stay at periscope depth. The type I A had severe trouble with keeping bow or stern from breaking surface!

    Even running surfaced meant trouble as the design of the conning tower allowed large quantities of water to wash over.

    Both type I A boats were banished to use in U-boat school (if the trainees would learn to control a I A they would easily learn to manage other types of U-boats).

    Later on, during the war, these boats were put into active war duty - no matter their bad reputation.

    2 were built: U 25 and U 26.



    II-A (1935) Hochsee-Tauchboot (Highsea Diveboat) “Dugout canoe”

    This coastal U-boat type was based on German wwI UB II, UF and the Finnish "Vesikko". It had been pre-fabricated in Finland, The Netherlands and Spain as, at the time, Germany weren't allowed to build or have any submarines according to the Versailles treaty.
    The first type II boats launched showed to be extremely seaworthy and of good, trustworthy design. Exactly what German Navy needed and hoped for. However, the boat was a small coastal type with a limited maximum range.
    6 were built: U 1 - U 6.



    II-B
    (1935) Korvettenkapitän Thedsen, a WW I veteran, now flotilla engineer of 1st Flotilla "Weddigen" (the only flotilla at that time) without changing any structure or design, modified the interior of type II A. Through that the type II B was born.
    With room for about nine more tons of diesel, maximum range almost doubled!
    Six II B's were transferred over land to the Black Sea and the 30th Flotilla at Constanza, Romania.
    There were two odd versions of the type II B, unofficially called the "China Boats" as they originally were built for export to China.

    However because of the different conning tower they proved to be not seaworthy and were adopted no further.
    20 were built: U 7 - U 24
    plus U 120 and U 121 (the two "China Boats").



    II-C
    (1938) The C version of type II was the result of further development of the II A and II B. The type II C carried even more diesel fuel - further improving the operational radius. It had faster diving time, improved electrical motors, etc.
    8 were built: U 56 - U 63.



    II-D
    (1938) The D version of type II were of course based on the earlier A, B and C boats. Added external fuel bunkers to further increase the operational length, was the basic difference. These extra tanks more than trippled the operational radius compared to type II A.
    16 were built: U 137 - U 152.



    III
    (1933)
    “Never Built” Ocean going / Conventional Mine Carrier “Never Built”
    The type III was improved in a 1934 project to take 48 mines.
    It was similar to the type III but was to have a larger hull to be able to do that.
    Because of its expected limited operational value it was halted.

    Similar to type IA but with more additional storage space aft of the torpedo tubes for a total of 21 torpedoes or 42 TMA mines. 5 torpedo tubes (4 at the bow below the CWL and one at the stern), two 105mm/45 deck guns aft and fore of the conning tower. No contracts were granted for these boats



    III-34
    (1934)
    “Never Built” Ocean going / Conventional Boat Carrier “Never Built”
    This extraordinary 1933 type (a modification of the Turkish Gür) never were built. It was designed to carry two motor torpedo boats in quite a large section, a "hangar", right behind the conning tower(!)

    An interesting idea being that the U-boat would level allowing the boats to depart and return afloat.

    But as this only could be performed in very calm sea, the main idea didn't work. Therefore the type III never was put into production.

    Originally known as the type VII, again similar to the type IA but with larger outer hull which could house 48 TMA mines. The design called for a large pressure-tight hangar for two 10-ton LS-boats. The project was abandoned due to its great expense and limited operational value.



    IV
    (19??)
    “Never Built” Workshop type Milk cows “Never Built”
    An exciting idea of making a supply and workshop type resulted in the plans for type IV. It was to, like the later "Milk cows", hide and serve the front line U-boats.

    Project for a supply and workshop boat for front line U-boats (similar concept to the Milk cows). No contracts granted for these boats.



    V
    (19??)
    “Never Built” Project for a Professor Walter-technology based U-boat. “Never Built”



    VI
    (19??)
    “Never Built” Experimenting with steam propulsion this was another redesign of / based upon the type I A. Redesign of the type IA but with a steam propulsion, based on a suggestion by Schmidt-Hartmann. “Never Built” LOOK AT XV

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    VII-A (1936) The infamous type VII boats were definitely the backbone of the Kriegsmarine. The type VII A, sea and ocean going U-boat, based on WWI UB III and Finnish "Vetehinen", was first launched in June 1936. Just about a year after the type II A, U 1 - the first German submarine since the end of ww I.
    Pretty much because of its origin the type VII boat was exceptionally seaworthy and easy to handle, no matter type of sea.
    10 were built: U 27 - U 36.



    VII-B
    (1938) In 1938 the VII B was launched. A completely modified and improved version of the VII A.
    At that time the new design was considered the best to be made and German authorities thought it to become THE boat of the Unterseebootwaffe..
    24 were built: U 45 - U 55, U 73 - U 76, U 83 - 87 and
    U 99 - U 102..



    VII-C
    (1940) The VII B served well but soon war conditions and a few unforeseen problems demanded further improvement.

    The type VII C was born, based on the earlier type VII's, earned knowledge, skill and facts of war duty.

    The VII C really proved to be an outstanding multi-purpouse boat.
    Therefore it became the most produced type and used for a variety of missions throughout WW II.
    The VII C received a large number of individual modifications to gain even further improvement - for war operations and experimetal use.
    568 were built: U 69 - U 72, U 77 - U 82, U 88 - U 98, U 132 - U 136,
    U 201 - U 212, U 221 - U 232, U 235 - U 329, U 331 - U 458, U 465 - U 486,
    U 551 - U 683, U 701 - U 722, U 731 - U 779, U 821 - U 822, U 825 - U 828,
    U 901 - 908, U 921 - U 930, U 951 - U 1032, U 1051 - U 1058, U 1063 - U 1065,
    U 1101 - U 1110, U 1131 - U 1132, U 1161-1162 , U 1191 - U1210,
    .



    VII-C/41
    (1941) An improved version of VII C with better armored conning tower, stronger pressure hull (which allowed dives to some 250 m) and several other, minor modifications.
    The changes were so small that there was no major mechanical difference between the VII C and the VII C / 41.

    The museum ship U 995 in Laboe, Kiel, Germany is a type VII C / 41

    Number of boats built 91.

    U292 - U300, U317 - U328, U827 - U828, U929 - U930, U995, U997 - U1010, U1013 - U1025, U1063 - U1065, U1103 - U1110 U1163- U 1172,U 1271 - U 1279 and U 1301 - U 1308.



    VII-C/42
    (1942?)
    “Never Built” C/42 Hochsee-Tauchboote (Highsea Diveboat)
    Planned to replace the VII standard boats.
    Was to take two more torpedoes and to have an even more improved pressure hull than the VII C / 41. The improvement of the pressure hull were to give this type 100% improved depth capabilities like diving depth: 200 and crush depth: 400 !!!
    Fascinating but as the new type XXI was to be developed and produced none of the type VII C / 42 were built.



    VII-D
    (1941) Minen-Uboot (Mine sub)
    The type VII D was entirely based on the VII C but had an additional section addad behind the conning tower. This extra section held 15 mines.
    6 were built: U 213 - U 218.



    VII-E
    (1940?)
    “Never Built” The VII E was the same as VII C but with a smaller engine to save space and weight. The VII E-project came no further than the drawing board. “Never Built”



    VII-F
    (1943) Transport-Uboot (transport sub)Loads of torpedoes(21 max)
    Similar to type VII D with an extra section added - but the added section for the VII F was located after the forward torpedo room. The additional section was for carrying extra mines or cargo. 4 were built: U 1059 - U 1062.

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