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Thread: Luftwaffe Cannons & Machineguns.

  1. #151
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    I remember reading one of Adolf Galland's
    missions. As he was climbing with his wingman in
    their Me 262 in an interception attack against a
    B-17, he told him to ignore the tail gunner's fire at
    1,000 yards. I think he then fired a one-second
    burst from his MK108s at 400 or 500 yards.

    He saw four or five blasts around the airframe
    and wings, and the B-17 went down immediately.

  2. #152
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    Default Mg151/20

    The MG151/20 has a reputation of being a powerful cannon, and Denel's Rooivalk's XC-F2
    is based on it.

    However, the cartridge is quite short and about the same as the MG-FF, 82 mm compared to the Hispano's 110. Thus the amount of propellant could not have been much more than the MG-FF. How did it manage to achieve the higher muzzle velocity then - the longer barrel ?

    Its muzzle velocity of 750 m/sec still fell short of the Hispano Mk 2's 880 m/sec, however. What accounted for its reputed hard-hitting power then ? Was it the higher destructive capacity of its mine shell - 17 grams of HE versus only 6 grams in the Hispano ?
    Last edited by Tham; 07-20-2007 at 02:53 AM.

  3. #153

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    The cartridge case of the MG 151/20 held more propellant because it was wider. The M-Geschoss' HE capacity was less than double the Hispano's, which held about 10-11g, but it was enough to make it more destructive in certain circumstances.
    Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website

  4. #154
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    Experimental weapons, Recoiless cannons:

    Gerät 104 Münchhausen.



    With the objective to destroy the naval supremacy dsiplayed by the Royal Navy compared with the Kriegsmarine at the beginning of of the war a massive cannon was developed in 1939-40 with the target of attacking british battleships and other strongly armored objectives.
    The "element 104" was a weapon with an impressive caliber of 356 mm, designed to attack the ships with an armor piercing explosive war head.

    Obviously the enormous recoil forces of a conventional gun of that caliber made it inadequate for its aeronautical use. For that reason it use the principle of the recoilless weapons, in this case allowing to of escape to gases of the firing by behind and that as well dragged capsula of propellant with a counterbalance, this balanced the two forces annulling the recoil.

    The barrel:

    The tube was made of chromium nickel molybdenum steel, it had a right hand twist. A belt for reinforcement was located in the zone where the propellant was deflagrated. The overall length was more than 10 meters.



    (drawing from:'German Aircraft Guns: WWI - WWII', Edward J. Hoffschmidt, WE Inc. 1969)

    The ammunition of 356 mm:

    The projectile of 35,56 cm was an armor-piercing shot of chromium steel with an explosive charge of TNT in the base and slowed down fuze of impact to allow him to explode within the ship once obtained the penetration. The driving band of the projectile was pre-engraved and it match the grooves of the barrel. This diminished the amount stress of the tube in the firing and therefore allowed a tube of thinner walls but of smaller weight. In order to introduce the ammunition two halves of the G-104 were unscrewed. The weight of the projectile was of 700 kg and the initial speed about 320 meters per second. In order to prove if the weapon were really recoiless it was tested ffrst on a car over of narrow railroad.


    The results were satisfactory (in some ocation the barrel moves slightly forwards after shot) The next stage was the probes in a fake aircraft body.

    In tests with false nose and tail of Do-17, notice the ammunition load of 356mm down completes with propellant and counterbalance to the left.



    After shooting the gases slightly damaged the covering of fuselage in spite of the gas baffle plates located in each end. Nevertheless this problem was not serious and the weapon and the test continues until 1941 even was teorically proposed its use in the Ju-88, and He-177.

  5. #155
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    Two more images of the Gerät 104.



    Probably the development of this anti-ship weapon was dropped in favor of the guided weapons like the Hs 293 and Ruhrstal FX 1400.

  6. #156
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    This is really weird, experiemntal mounting for BK 3,7 in a Ju-288 nose.






    No idea how it was loaded, manually I guess.

  7. #157
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    280 mm recoiless cannon for JU-288:

    This projekt is similar to the Gerät 104, but it use a smaller ( if a 28cm shell is small) caliber with a double back gasses derivation.
    This derivation system allowed the gun to by embeded in the Ju-288 fuselage and gave it better aerodinamics characteristics.
    One of his most remarcable characteristics is that it seems to lack the counterweight.




    Muzzle speed: 560 m/s.

    Projectile type: APHE

    Projectile weight; 400 Kg

    Armor penetration (estimated): 200 mm Face hardened plate ( shot from an angle of 32º dive)

    No more data available, it remains as proyect only.

  8. #158

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    How is the exhaust gas meant to escape from that? The blast at the back end of an RCL is ferocious, and in this drawing appears to be directed into the rear fuselage...
    Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website

  9. #159
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    It escaped passing by two nozzles, one in the right fuselage and other in the left.

    However my opinion is that probably the blast would damage the lower duraluminiun skin in the wingroots, and yes... it is a little crazy.

  10. #160
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    SG 113 "Förstersonde " recoiless 77 mm gun.

    "Sonder Gerät", special material Nº 113 was a development of Herman Göring Werke of Brunswick ( a Reinmethall-Borsig subsidiary) in response of a RLM directive looking for a improved accuracy cannon devoted for ground attack only.

    The SG 113 was basicly a single shot gun with a 77mm caliber tube loaded with a saboted 45mm steel core ap ammo, in the back of the cartrigde there was a counterweight wich was discarded and proyected backwards (or upwards depending upon the guns placemenent) to equilibrate the recoil forces.



    Each tube had a lenght of 1600mm and weight (loaded) 67 kilograms.
    Using the experience of Dr. Hackemann and Dr. Schwetzke employees of the LFA firm , HGw developed an electromagnetically triggered mechanism equipment. This mechanism responded to the electrostatic field surrounding the tank.


    This cannon was first emplaced in 3 Hs-129B-0 aircrafts for testing in mid-1944.
    The instalation in the Hs-129 comprised six tubes embeded in the mid fuselage, the muzzles had a 10º angle backwards. Its battery was trigerred by a "T" shaped sensor antenna in the nose of the Henschel.

    Hs-129B-0 WrkN 0016



    This aircrafts were used intensively in shooting test in the Rechlin Lutwaffe facilities in late 1944.

    Upper view, 6 x SG-113 guns.


  11. #161
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    Two images of the Rechlin test with the SG 113.

    Missed shot on T-34.




    Hit on top armor.


  12. #162
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    SG 113 in FW-190F:



    Into the FW 190 twin tubes were built in each case on the right of and left by the trunk into the surfaces. The effect of the weapon was considerable, depending upon hit angle could it one 40 mm strong armoring with 60° and 50 mm with 75° impact angle smoothly pierce and/or strongly distort and promised thus a good success with the fight of armored targets.



    To monitoring of the hit results was done via one parallel to the weapon inserted Robot camera with the shot was at the same time released.



    Both tubes were installed into a common lining stood out in each case 700mm above and down from the bearing area of the L.G. 190. For forced down landings the SG 113 barrel could be ejected by means of small explosive charges by a simple mechanism below 300 km/h.

    Flying path of aproach to target with the SG 113, note the sensors one below each wing.



    Is not know if the SG 113 was actually used in combat.

  13. #163
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    I forgot to mention that in the Hs-129 the six tubes could be fired individually of a full burst of the entire SG 113 barrels.

  14. #164
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    Reinhmetall SG 116 'Zellendusche'

    Sonder Gerät 116 'Zellendusche' ( cell shower) was a recoiless 30mm cannon.This equipment was developed, in order to make attacks possible on hostile bomber formations by flying underneath.



    The triggering device was operated by means a "photoelectric cell feeler", a plant working according to kind of the exposure meter, which was released only directly during the target approach before flying underneath the opponent.

    Sensor devices were manufactured by the company Opta-Radio. The weapon was built with Rheinmetall Borsig. The SG 116 was built into three different arrangements: four pieces in rhombic form in the trunk, six pieces in double triangle form or 3 pieces in line in the trunk sidewall with a Spreitzung of 2 degrees.The last model of the SG 116 was emplaced in the FW-190. Several testing took place with whe FW-190, He-117 even the lesser Fw 58.



    Lenght of individual barrel: 1,65 m
    Muzzle speed. 825 m/s.

  15. #165
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    Hello,

    the Förster company still exist today and is still using the metal detecting technic to produce professional metal detectors. Funny that our EOD used that war inventory to find dud bombs and ammo - from wars end until today.

    Here is an experimental projectile missing the sabbots from the SG 113. Found some years ago at the Luftwaffen proofing ground Rechlin.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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