Türk porno yayini yapan http://www.smfairview.com ve http://www.idoproxy.com adli siteler rokettube videolarini da HD kalitede yayinlayacagini acikladi. Ayrica porno indir ozelligiyle de http://www.mysticinca.com adli porno sitesi devreye girdi.
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 16 to 23 of 23

Thread: Why the fixation with big tanks?

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Buffalo, New York
    Posts
    7,404

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by leccy View Post
    The French had enough problems keeping their Panthers on the road in France so despite the internet claims that one was sent (and has been seen by US troops along with various other people not one of whom managed to photograph it) I am very dubious as to why it would be sent. The most common and used tank by the French in Indo China was the M24 Chaffee as it was light, had a reasonable gun and armour and good mobility which many of their other armoured vehicles lacked.
    Yeah, I don't see the French sending the Panther to Vietnam as it was pretty marginal in the infantry support category...

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Buffalo, New York
    Posts
    7,404

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2nd of foot View Post
    An interesting outlook but I thing Leccy's point is more valid. The UK got rid of it's M4s PDQ after hostilities. I have seen written some place that the only reason the M4 was not completely replaced by the Cromwell for D-Day was because they had so many M4s.
    I'd be interested in knowing the advantages the Cromwell had over the Sherman....

    Going back to the original point about over complexed and heavy tanks being a fixation of the German tank development. Was there one person or committee who had the job of working out what was needed or was it just down to one-upmanship on the part of designers? Did Germany have a central design committee and if so who was on it?
    I'm admittedly no expert on German tank design during the war, but the Tiger tank was the genesis of prewar models of a 'break-though tank' the Heer had anticipated would be needed to match the French Char B...

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    South West
    Posts
    953

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    I'd be interested in knowing the advantages the Cromwell had over the Sherman....
    The Shermans were lend lease so would have to be paid for if kept,
    With the draw down in units not so many tanks would be required,
    Cromwell had an equivalent gun to the 75mm armed Shermans while being faster, thicker armour (although not sloped), lower, better cross country and climbing ability's,
    British parts so no need to pay foreign countries for spares.
    The Comet was coming in increased numbers along with the Centurion so less need for the Fireflys or Challengers (fireflys seemed to have been sold to many countries though by Britain).

    Countries like Holland kept Shermans (and Ram's) as they had no tank production so took what they could get (quite often from scrap or disused vehicles compounds).

    I'm admittedly no expert on German tank design during the war, but the Tiger tank was the genesis of prewar models of a 'break-though tank' the Heer had anticipated would be needed to match the French Char B...[/QUOTE]

    An often overlooked point about the Tiger I, it was not designed as a response to the Soviets but as a response to the French tanks (Souma S35, Char B1) and later British tank (Matilda II) that the Germans came up against and was based on much earlier designs.
    IN the days of lace-ruffles, perukes and brocade
    Brown Bess was a partner whom none could despise
    An out-spoken, flinty-lipped, brazen-faced jade,
    With a habit of looking men straight in the eyes
    At Blenheim and Ramillies fops would confess
    They were pierced to the heart by the charms of Brown Bess.

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    424

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nickdfresh View Post
    I'm admittedly no expert on German tank design during the war, but the Tiger tank was the genesis of prewar models of a 'break-though tank' the Heer had anticipated would be needed to match the French Char B...
    The "DW" designs were still fitted with the short 75mm howitzers, precluding a task of hitting soft targets, bunkers and guns. Didn't go that far away from the pzIV concept. It did not have an envisaged anti-tank role.
    The Tiger on the other hand was eventually a scrapbook after the start of the war of an uparmoured and uppowered chassis within new army demands (way beyond the weight of the DW series, freed from bridge-restrictions due to fording capacity) and a specific anti-tank purpose gun and heavy turret of the Porsche design. Yes, the design was quite pre-Barbarossa, but not really prewar.
    Last edited by steben; 08-26-2013 at 07:49 AM.
    It is nice to have big heavy tanks, it is even nicer not to need them

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    New Jersey, USA
    Posts
    168

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    This is a very good discussion, many good opinions. Let me ask this, would Germany have been better off producing just the panzer fours, thereby probably having them in greater numbers , than switching over to the Panthers and Tigers which had issues with reliability and limited road accesibility? Not to mention the bigger ones were slower to produce and more costly.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Trento
    Posts
    105

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    Like Nickdfresh pointed out, use of medium/heavy tanks as armored spear to break enemy lines while light/medium tanks act after is a common tactic in WWII.
    At the same time, I think that part of "success" of heavy and super heavy Nazi tanks is based upon the change of tactic in general. Introduction of Panther and Tiger see Wermacht starting to act as a defensive force, where they normally fight in "closed space" like cities. In this scenario, slowly up armored heavy tanks are more useful than light fast tanks.

    @Leccy
    I think that the approach of what is reliable is very different. For sure when Guderian says that reliability of mechanics system is a weapon, he said well. But at the same time, in wartime theory is not followed very well.
    I mean, also T-34 on the first revision is not exactly a "reliable" vehicle, but with some modification it became reliable. While during interwar the Nazi/Russian bureaus had all the time to design, test and refine their prototype in wartime they simple press into service everything it seems to give an advantage on the battlefield. Panther is not perfect, but his designers have only one year from initial real request to production of a prototype.
    Pauci sed semper immites!

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    South West
    Posts
    953

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    Quote Originally Posted by burp View Post
    Like Nickdfresh pointed out, use of medium/heavy tanks as armored spear to break enemy lines while light/medium tanks act after is a common tactic in WWII.
    At the same time, I think that part of "success" of heavy and super heavy Nazi tanks is based upon the change of tactic in general. Introduction of Panther and Tiger see Wermacht starting to act as a defensive force, where they normally fight in "closed space" like cities. In this scenario, slowly up armored heavy tanks are more useful than light fast tanks.

    @Leccy
    I think that the approach of what is reliable is very different. For sure when Guderian says that reliability of mechanics system is a weapon, he said well. But at the same time, in wartime theory is not followed very well.
    I mean, also T-34 on the first revision is not exactly a "reliable" vehicle, but with some modification it became reliable. While during interwar the Nazi/Russian bureaus had all the time to design, test and refine their prototype in wartime they simple press into service everything it seems to give an advantage on the battlefield. Panther is not perfect, but his designers have only one year from initial real request to production of a prototype.
    The Panther was designed to make use of an hard to produce final drive system, they opted for a cheaper and quicker to make type that was a constant point of failure after a very short space of time.

    The Panzer IV had an auxilary power unit to traverse the main gun - the Panthers was reliant on main engine revs which to conserve the life of the engines was reduced.

    The Gunner had one sight - no panoramic sight with a wide field of vision to enable them to aquire a target as directed by the commander (the French in their post war report on the ones they used said this added 30 secs to aim time over a Sherman)

    All of these were limitations they deliberately built into what was supposed to be their premier tank, things that were already in use in their earlier tanks - which actually made it worse than the tank it was supposed to replace in many aspects
    IN the days of lace-ruffles, perukes and brocade
    Brown Bess was a partner whom none could despise
    An out-spoken, flinty-lipped, brazen-faced jade,
    With a habit of looking men straight in the eyes
    At Blenheim and Ramillies fops would confess
    They were pierced to the heart by the charms of Brown Bess.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Trento
    Posts
    105

    Default Re: Why the fixation with big tanks?

    All choices made in order to save money. In pre-war Germany, money aren't a problem so the designers can use whatever they want, more or less. In wartime Germany the problem of expansive tanks start to grow.
    Pauci sed semper immites!

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •