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Chevan
01-13-2009, 03:59 AM
Hi to everyone.
I found out an intereting article in Wiki about Russian pilot, who was shoted down in 1944, was imprisoned by Germans, have been sent to Germany and ....fly back to Russian on Henkel 111.;)
The story is real , the man's name Mikhail Devyataev.
Here is the introduction.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Devyatayev


Escape
Devyataev managed to convince the other nine prisoners in his work gang that he could fly them to freedom. The men chose a time when the guard dogs would be taken away for training to seize their chance.

In the early morning of 8 February 1945, as the ten Soviet POWs, including Devyataev, were at work on the runway, one of the work gang, Ivan Krivonogov picked up a crowbar and killed their guard. Another prisoner, Peter Kutergun, quickly stripped off the guard's uniform and slipped it on. The work gang, led by the "guard", managed to unobtrusively take over the camp commandant's He 111 H22 bomber and fly from the island. Devyataev piloted the aircraft. The Germans tried to intercept the bomber but without success. The aircraft was damaged by the Soviet air defences but managed to land in Soviet-held territory. The escapees provided important information about the German missile program, especially about the V-1 and V-2.

The NKVD did not believe Devyataev's story, arguing that it was impossible for the prisoners to take over an airplane without cooperation from the Germans. Thus, Devyataev was suspected of being a German spy and sent to a penal military unit along with the other nine men. Of the escapees, five died in action over the following months. Devyataev himself spent the remainder of the war in prison
Only in 1957 Mikhail was reabilitated and has become the Hero of SU.

Major Walter Schmidt
01-13-2009, 09:36 PM
Wow....that is very interesting.
Are there any other similar stories?

Schuultz
01-14-2009, 08:51 AM
Impressive. But how did they manage to overcome the guards of the airplane and shake off the German fighters?

And there was really only one guard for the guys, who even stood close enough to be surprised by an attack with a crowbar? Pretty dumb on his part...

Caboliver
01-17-2009, 07:35 AM
How could he manage to fly a German plane? Do different planes from different countries have similar "controls"?

Rising Sun*
01-17-2009, 08:02 AM
Do different planes from different countries have similar "controls"?

No.

Soviet planes had everything on the far left.

German planes had everything on the far right.

Vichy planes had everything close to the far right, but this could change under pressure.

Italian planes had them where they had style.

British planes had them in the middle.

The Americans just put them where they wanted them.

Caboliver
01-17-2009, 08:05 AM
I don't know much about operating planes and English is not my first language. I asked if it's hard to fly a German plane if you have only been trained with soviets ones.

Rising Sun*
01-17-2009, 08:10 AM
I don't know much about operating planes and English is not my first language. I asked if it's hard to fly a German plane if you have only been trained with soviets ones.

Mate, I'm sorry.

I was having a bit of fun in responding to your post.

If I knew you weren't a natural English speaker I wouldn't have.

Caboliver
01-17-2009, 09:50 AM
That's why I have put the word controls in these little thingies ""
What's a better word to call it? Operating system?

Schuultz
01-17-2009, 10:19 AM
No.

Soviet planes had everything on the far left.

German planes had everything on the far right.

Vichy planes had everything close to the far right, but this could change under pressure.

Italian planes had them where they had style.

British planes had them in the middle.

The Americans just put them where they wanted them.

Hahaha, I actually thought you were serious until I got to Vichy...:mrgreen:

Carl Schwamberger
01-18-2009, 08:02 PM
I'm a bit slow. It was the Italians that tipped me off.

As for the escape. Desperate moments result in fantastic things. If Devyataev had completed training in multi engine aircraft then he probablly could have got the plane aloft. Avoiding the German fighters would have depended on daylight, clouds, route, altitude, German air defense coordination, so many things to happen right or wrong. Devyataev may also have had the opportunity to observe the aircraft in operation, or perhaps look it over if he were assigned to clean it.

Chevan
01-19-2009, 12:00 AM
No.

Soviet planes had everything on the far left.

German planes had everything on the far right.

Vichy planes had everything close to the far right, but this could change under pressure.

Italian planes had them where they had style.

British planes had them in the middle.

The Americans just put them where they wanted them.
Hahaha, I actually thought you were serious until I got to Vichy...:mrgreen:

Ah ha ha ha.
He laways is ...damn serious:mrgreen:

Chevan
01-19-2009, 12:07 AM
Impressive. But how did they manage to overcome the guards of the airplane and shake off the German fighters?

The fighters were actualy send to interrupt the "Lonely Henkel". But becouse the weather was cloudy , Devyataev with felows were sucesfull to escape.
Besides it was in Febriary of 1945- the FrontLine wasn't far from his camp.

Chevan
01-19-2009, 12:23 AM
How could he manage to fly a German plane? Do different planes from different countries have similar "controls"?
It's very true question mr Caboliver.
And it was the first question of NKVD to Devyataev:)
But fact is fact- man has done it.
Becouse there were no OTHER pilots in his team.
Mikhail was an experienced fighter-pilot.
BTW He told - he wasn't first russian pilot who tried to drive away the German plaine. One has tryed to do it- but has crushed during the taking off.

Schuultz
01-19-2009, 08:15 AM
I suppose the fundamentals of the plane would be relatively easy to find out. Other things he would have had to do Trial & Error.

But who knows, maybe there was an Operator's Manual in the glove department ;)

Nickdfresh
01-19-2009, 08:38 AM
I think if he figured out the controls and was able to securely board the aircraft, it would have been actually difficult for the Luftwaffe to intercept him. By the time they got planes scrambled he may well have been out of intercept range...

Schuultz
01-19-2009, 09:03 AM
Well, Chevan, Nickdfresh has a point. How long did it take the Germans to notice that he fled? Did they notice immediately and try to stop him?

Also, considering how late in war it was, they might have decided to let him go. They probably didn't want to waste any airplanes/fuel to try to stop a couple of unimportant PoWs from escaping...

Chevan
01-20-2009, 01:38 AM
Well, Chevan, Nickdfresh has a point. How long did it take the Germans to notice that he fled? Did they notice immediately and try to stop him?

Also, considering how late in war it was, they might have decided to let him go. They probably didn't want to waste any airplanes/fuel to try to stop a couple of unimportant PoWs from escaping...
Well i do understand al of you questions, i found out the site where the his recollections have been published.
http://www.newepoch.ru/topics/devyataev.html
But this is Russian. Sorry dudes, i/m too lazy to translate it to English ( and honesly , i'm not sure i will have done it correctly) so i will use the Internet translation.
http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-home&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.newepoch.ru%2Ftopics%2Fdevy ataev.html&lp=ru_en&btnTrUrl=Translate

I hope i've halped.

Uyraell
02-15-2009, 10:53 PM
As long as things like throttle quadrant, flap levers, and undercarriage levers are known in their operant or passive positions the rest becomes moot.
Reference the few occasions in recent years where light aircraft pilots have landed 747's and the like.
Granted, the cited example in this thread was during a war, but the basics of operating an aircraft would remain broadly constant.
Fundamentally, it isn't different to a Russian driving an Opel Blitz truck after being trained on the Russian copy of the American Studebaker truck the same size.

Regards, Uyraell.

Chevan
02-16-2009, 01:48 AM
Russian copy of the American Studebaker truck the same size.

What a copy?
SOviets produced Zis -151 it wasn't a studebekker copy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZiS-151

Uyraell
02-17-2009, 01:47 AM
What a copy?
SOviets produced Zis -151 it wasn't a studebekker copy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZiS-151

With great respect : the article you cite says plainly the vehicle it describes was preceeded BY the ZiS6 : a copy of the Studebaker.

""The ZiS-151 was the first major Soviet military all-wheel-drive truck built following World War II, replacing the U.S. Studebaker US6, and earlier ZiS-6.""

So, bearing in mind the timeframe, I'd say the point I made was a reasonably fair one.

Respectful Regards, Uyraell.

alephh
02-24-2009, 03:29 PM
Amazing story (if true). :-)

May also reveal something about the collapse of German discipline in 1945 ;-)

But I can't help but feel sorry for the Russians who pulled these kind of amazing feats - only to be sent to Gulags.

Chevan
02-25-2009, 12:02 AM
But I can't help but feel sorry for the Russians who pulled these kind of amazing feats - only to be sent to Gulags.
He wasn't sent to GULAG, to your possible distress, sir:)He was sent to Penalty unit. But war was almost over so he soon restored in amry an demobilized in november 1945.
But NKVD didn't believe to him becouse it was really odd story.It was probably single such a case in entire ww2.

alephh
02-25-2009, 03:15 PM
But I can't help but feel sorry for the Russians who pulled these kind of amazing feats - only to be sent to Gulags.
He wasn't sent to GULAG

I'm not saying he was sent to Gulag. I'm saying many Russians were sent to Gulags.

Gulag == "a bad place" in general ==== treated unfairly.
Sent == ruggedly dragged, not carried with white horses while champagne and virgins were given to everybody.

Chevan
02-25-2009, 11:56 PM
I'm not saying he was sent to Gulag. I'm saying many Russians were sent to Gulags.

Nor more than 3% of former Soviet POWs ( from about 1,5 mln liberated in 1945) have bee imprisoned or executed.


Gulag == "a bad place" in general ==== treated unfairly.
Sent == ruggedly dragged, not carried with white horses while champagne and virgins were given to everybody.
Oh , for those who has got the "champagne and virgins" in Germany( kinda- ROA , Kossaken and others colloborators) , the Gulag was a VERY right place.

brunoz
02-26-2009, 09:58 AM
Hi, there !! :D


No.
Soviet planes had everything on the far left.
German planes had everything on the far right.
Vichy planes had everything close to the far right, but this could change under pressure.
Italian planes had them where they had style.
British planes had them in the middle.
The Americans just put them where they wanted them.

Sorry for picking up this post but... I fell over the floor laughing when I saw it!
Hey, Rising Sun*, tell us about the Japanese planes, come on!

About the stolen Heinkel, well, it may be a real story actually, why not?
I remember having read that the crew of an Italian "Bersaglieri" sidecar had
lost it's way during a sandstorm on the Libyan front, Summer 1942; they got
through it, finally, but they also got through the 8th Army lines and drove
ahead, eventually reaching the suburbs of Alexandria (perhaps even cheered)
and got finally captured. They had great problems explaining how they got
there, the Brits must have thought the front had collapsed somewhere :!: :lol:

Bye.
Bruno.