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Ardee
12-19-2008, 12:23 PM
Hi all,

I wondering if someone can help me out with a couple of scale drawings I've been looking for without much success. I am specifically referring to the 100% profile, black-and-white variety that are typically found in period training manuals. These two have proven elusive:

Flak 38 (preferably without the shield, and with the gun at 0 degrees elevation)

Flammenwerfer 34, a.k.a. 35.

I have a color version of the Flak 38, but it looks terrible when I try to change it to a b&w line drawing. I've never found a scale drawing of the flamethrower. Any help would be appreciated!

Schuultz
01-02-2009, 08:02 PM
Trying to build one of your own? ;)

Ardee
01-05-2009, 02:16 PM
Trying to build one of your own?

Actually, no, I'm not, but the full explanation would probably take a lot longer than you'd find worth reading! Probably the best short answer would be part historic interest, and part war-game related. So I'm not looking for large-scale images, loaded with specifications, measurements, etc. I'm just looking for what might be called "recognition" images -- profile for the gun, and (to correct my initial post) a rear view for the flamethrower. Most military manuals I've come across have pages that are, what, five or six inches wide? Maybe eight or ten inches if turned landscape? The type of image I'm looking for would fit easily on such a single page.

gojulas
01-06-2009, 12:45 AM
Hope this will help you

Schuultz
01-06-2009, 07:41 AM
Hope this will help you

not bad, that's quite the drawing... but this looks almost too detailed for what Ardee seemed to request?
If I understood him right, he wanted scale drawings from the side which show the outside of the actual weapon, not the inside :)

Ardee
01-06-2009, 12:37 PM
Oops.

Actually, I believe both of you are correct.! Thank you for the nice image, gojulas. I'm slightly embarrassed to confess I overlooked a crucial detail: I forgot there are two different guns with the designation of flak 38. :oops: You provided an image of the 105mm gun; I have been looking for one of the 20mm (2cm) gun!

Schuultz is correct that I'm looking for an image of the outside of the weapon, but I believe that is what gojulas provided -- IIRC, the flywheels, etc, that appear in the image are external. The image does has a little more detail than needed, but I think I could work with the level of what is there.

I said I had a color version of the type of image of looking for; I am posting that below, and also including a sample (the AFV) of the level of detail/type of image that would be "ideal." I've tried editing the color version of the Flak gun into the "AFV" type of image, but the result looked -- bad. Probably I just lack the software knowledge/skill. I guess I've learned a lesson about providing examples when making a request like this one....

http://img153.imagevenue.com/loc1033/th_63569_scale_drawings_122_1033lo.jpg (http://img153.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=63569_scale_drawings_122_1033lo.jpg)

Schuultz
01-06-2009, 02:41 PM
Before I do any research, do you want the Flakvierling (the one with 4 barrels) or the standart Flak 38?

Out of curiosity, what do you mean with "war-game related"?

Ardee
01-06-2009, 07:20 PM
Hi Schuultz,

I'm referring to the single-barreled gun, hopefully without the shield, pretty much like the color image above, in a "ready to fire" position, at 0 degrees elevation. Thanks for at least being willing to look!

Since it will be of limited interest, I'll send you a PM re your other question.

Schuultz
01-06-2009, 08:08 PM
Ok, they might only be of limited use for you, as they're all colored, but those are the ones I found.
If you want me to try to change them to black & white or whatever, I can try my luck with Photoshop, too.
http://i455.photobucket.com/albums/qq271/Schuultz/20mmflak30_main.jpg
http://i455.photobucket.com/albums/qq271/Schuultz/20mmflak38_main.jpg
http://i455.photobucket.com/albums/qq271/Schuultz/flak38pic.gif

As for the ones that are elevated a bit - you could just pretend the enemy was uphill ^^

Ardee
01-07-2009, 02:46 PM
Hi Schuultz. Thanks for your efforts! If you wish to try turning one into a b&w line drawing, please -- be my guest! My next-best option is to make a tracing. I don't know how I'll repay the favor of your trying, but, as I implied above, my proficiency with graphics software is limited. My efforts have to date have always come lacking crispness and clarity, losing detail or worse...

Out of the three you provided and my initial image, I'd prefer either the one I gave (naturally! :) ) or the middle (yellow) one that you provided. The top one of your three images is, I believe, a 20mm Flak 30 instead of the 38, and that would be my third choice. The bottom image is of the 38, but with a shield, and also in traveling position.

gojulas
01-09-2009, 08:47 AM
Here are the all the flammenwerfer images i found hope you wil be able to use them

Ardee
01-09-2009, 01:45 PM
Thank you, gojulas, for all your effort! The first one in particular will be a big help -- I think with a little tweaking, it will be exactly what I need for the flammenwerfer! Is this a scan you made, or did you find it on the Internet? If it was on the 'net, I'd be interested in knowing where -- I've used umpteen search engines and never found anything that even came close to what you've provided!

rios
01-15-2009, 01:14 AM
Before I do any research, do you want the Flakvierling (the one with 4 barrels) or the standart Flak 38?

Out of curiosity, what do you mean with "war-game related"?

Hi schuultz, and everybody else.
I'm looking for line drawings of the quad 2cm Flakvierling 38, if you guys can help. I've actually bought a bunch of books on the subject, but they only have photos, not scale drawings and it's difficult to compare the dimension with 1:35 model kits.
The tamiya kit of this weapon is somewhat incorrect, I would like to try building a correct model, if the data would be available.

thanks

Ardee
01-15-2009, 11:51 AM
Hello Rios,

I'm sorry, but I don't have that one, either. And, unfortunately, the type of mistake you describe can be self-perpetuating and quite widespread. If you demand accuracy, you best bet is to try and locate the appropriate German military manual for the gun, which may be a lot easier said than done, though an inter-library loan program or writing to the German national archives is a possibility. Another option, depending on where on the gun your inaccuracy is located, might be to try and find detailed drawings of a vehicle mounting the gun, e.g., the Sd.Kfz 7/1... I believe I recall seeing a book designed for models that focused on that vehicle or one highly similar, and it had some good-sized drawings. Good luck!