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guyonthesofa1989
10-02-2006, 04:17 PM
hi, im new to the boards and ive got a few questions about a rifle that i found. we were cleaning out my great grand fathers house about a week ago and we found a rifle and some stuff from when he was in the army. i know its made by winchester but i dont know the model or when it was made. i think it was his old hunting rifle but dad remembers the storys about him sneaking it back in the barrel of a sherman tank so it might be a ww2 rifle. about how much is this gun worth and whats it shoot?

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293612.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561729)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293675.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561728)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293582.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561727)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293417.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561718)

guyonthesofa1989
10-02-2006, 04:18 PM
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293459.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561719)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293486.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561721)

guyonthesofa1989
10-02-2006, 04:19 PM
we tossed most of his old stuff because we did not have room to keep it but i kept the rifle. dad had no interest in it so i took it and started making it in to a home defence rifle im going to mount a lazer and a flashlight and maby a red dot scope next time the gun show comes around ill keep you updated on the project as it goes.

heres some pictures and videos of my project.

Click here to watch 1-cut (http://media.putfile.com/1-cut)
Click here to watch 2-cut (http://media.putfile.com/2-cut)
Click here to watch 3-grind (http://media.putfile.com/3-grind)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293441.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561720)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293588.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561722)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293583.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561723)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293586.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561724)

guyonthesofa1989
10-02-2006, 04:19 PM
the finish was slighly rough feeling to the touch so i sanded it down and made it nice and shiny. great grand pa would be proud.

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415293541.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561726)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415474727.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561883)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27415474751.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3561884)

guyonthesofa1989
10-02-2006, 08:28 PM
i found out that its a garand from another forum. there kinda getting angery at me but i think it looks alot cooler:roll: ive got some pictures that we found with the rifle. ill post them on here later.

any one know what the patches on the uniform mean?

guyonthesofa1989
10-02-2006, 08:34 PM
i found this rifle in my great grand fathers belongings while cleaning out his house. i did some mods to it. i did not even know what it was except my father thaught it was ww2 military. i found out on another forum that it was a m1 garand.

does any one know what the markings on the sleaves of the uniforum mean?


Edited by Dani: Topics merged. I seriously thinking of changing the name of this thread as well.

bas
10-02-2006, 10:02 PM
Congradulations you have turned a $1,000.00 rifle into a $500 rifle. Keep up the good work, and turn it into a $300 junker.

Btw it used to be a m1 Garand service rifle chambered in .30-06. Good luck firing that without the stock.

Also by throwing the uniforms away you probably threw away several hundred dollars.

I seriously hope this post is a joke. If not, you're a stupid fu*ker!

Lancer44
10-02-2006, 11:01 PM
i found out that its a garand from another forum. there kinda getting angery at me but i think it looks alot cooler:roll: ive got some pictures that we found with the rifle. ill post them on here later.

any one know what the patches on the uniform mean?

bas was right... I had never seen bigger stupidity...

Did you really throw out the lot of this stuff, because "you had no room to keep it???"
Even if some memory of your grandfather mean nothing to you, imagine someone throwing possibly about $2000, just because he had no space in his wallet...
And I give you some advice: After all you did, never go even close to some re-enactors group. And never tell anyone what you just did.
Some guys are passionate and you maybe in serious trouble.
Better stay on your sofa and watch the box.

Lancer44

Dani
10-03-2006, 12:13 AM
dad had no interest in it so i took it and started making it in to a home defence rifle

Too pity that your father had no interest in the rifle. He wouldn't let you do what you did.


im going to mount a lazer and a flashlight and maby a red dot scope next time the gun show comes around ill keep you updated on the project as it goes.
At 17 years (assuming that 1989 from your name is your birth year and considering your posting style) I thought that you should be more wise.

Please have mercy on us and stop posting updates of your "project".

Joining this board might be a good opportunity for you to understand the past and to realise what stupid thing you did with your grandfather's rifle.

Gen. Sandworm
10-03-2006, 12:27 AM
Joining this board might be a good opportunity for you to understand the past and to realise what stupid thing you did with your grandfather's rifle.

Thou its sad tp see and I agree with Dani and the other members.......ill be a bit nicer. Please come here and learn. Next time you find an old rifle find out what it is first. Or hell send it to me. Ill take care of it for you :) No more home defense weapons.......of old rifles anyhow. Wal-mart ones are good enought. My dad would have kicked me up side the head if i would have sawed down the Japanese Arisaka rifle my grandpa brought back from the pacific.

While you made a mistake in destroying a nice piece of history ......... which sucks...... but hopefully now youll now better. Please feel free to ask questions here. Thats what the site is for.

And as for your project......dont think most of the members would be that keen on seeing it.

Anyhow welcome and I hope you learn something. Maybe we can figure out the patches on the shirt.

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 12:27 AM
ok ok im not going to let this go any farther. this was a joke. i own 9 m1 garands. the "winchester garand" pictured is actually 3 guns a H&R (first garand pictured on the bed), a winchester (reciever picture with photochoped serial number), and a polished SA wall hanger that was assambled from junk parts. i build garands 03s and carbines on the side for fun, i take stripped recievers and make them in to nice firearms with correct parts. me and a buddy pulled this prank on blade forums to frazzle a few friends who post on that site. they are garand NUTS even more so than i am.

the stock however is a unfortunite story, it is a verry rare HR offcenter stock that few were made of before the company lost there contract because the guns were not centered in the stock and actually left part of the rear of the reciever overhanging. the ONLY reasion i used it was because saturday my 1400 correct HR garand blew up because of a double loaded ka headstamped korean surplus ammo. luckly the gun survived unharmed besides the gasses breaking the stock in half longways. after i cut the stock on the saw the only thing holding it togeather was the front band, we had to fix it with school glue. so we could take the pictures. its sence been totaly destroyed. the really bad part is that ive seen rougher counterparts to that stock sell on gun sites for over 500.

i had these guys going pretty good, i thaught they were going to hang me and im sure a few of them would have if they could have gotten there hands on me.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=427098

the uniform and pictures are legit, they actually belonged to my late great uncle. he suffered from shell shock after the war and lived till the mid 80s. in the war he carried a rockola carbine (i know because of the rare I cut stock that he is pictured with)and was certified for a machine gun, im assuming the tommy gun because of the patches on the shirt. he was in and around layte and lazon if im spelling those correctly and was on the battle ship at the surrender, note the pictures in the other forum.

does anyone know what the patches mean?

Dani
10-03-2006, 12:43 AM
It's interesting because the patch looks like somehow mirroring the shoulder patch of the Royal Commando.
http://www.warchronicle.com/50th_div/historiantales_wwii/50div_pics.htm

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 12:44 AM
if i still have a account in the morning ill post scans of my great uncles disscharge papers, personal letters, and a letter from the president.
heres a few of the ww2 pictures, however we have missplaced the battle photos that included one of a shirman tank bogged down in mud and about 30 jap bodys laying around the tank. on the back was writen "phillipenes, traped in tank surrounded" and dated
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545189.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565185)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545163.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565187)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545177.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565188)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545133.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565189)

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 12:46 AM
i have one question about the surrender photos, could he have taken those or would they have been given out to troops that were on board the ship?
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545227.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565190)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545243.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565191)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545262.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565192)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27420545247.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3565193)

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 12:50 AM
It's interesting because the patch looks like somehow mirroring the shoulder patch of the Royal Commando.


is it possable to decode the stripes/bars pinned to the front? what would they tell us?

Dani
10-03-2006, 12:53 AM
is it possable to decode the stripes/bars pinned to the front? what would they tell us?
:D :D Ask Gen. Sandworm.;)

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 12:54 AM
you know the funny thing is that uniform fits me perfectly. i put it on one time and walked threw the house, my grand mother said i looked just like her brother. theres no way to tell but i think it may be the same uniform, atleast type of uniform as hes wearing in the picture of him setting on the jeep with his girlfriend.

Gen. Sandworm
10-03-2006, 01:02 AM
is it possable to decode the stripes/bars pinned to the front? what would they tell us?

Well I had trouble finding out what the others were but the first one is most likely the Army Good Conduct ribbon.

You can try searching here

http://www.defenselink.mil/specials/ribbons/

But these are the modern. Not sure how much they have changed since then.

Lancer44
10-03-2006, 05:34 AM
I think I pinpointed shirt badges. My information come from Greg Czwartosz, one of best Polish experts on US Army.
This are ESB badges. Engineers Special Brigade. Extremely rare uniform. Your great uncle guyonthesofa, was a bloke with balls! More than that! These fellows were going in front of every landing to clear mine fields and obstacles under fire. According to Greg this uniform is worth as much as good, I repeat, good car - not Toyota!

I may one day forgive you the pain you caused me "butchering" this Garand.
Send me contact on prive and I contact you with Greg.
He was busy today, but will tell you also everything about stripes at the front. I just have to calm him down first. He said that he would smash your skull with this bastardized Garand.

Don't play this sort of pranks on us, please...

Cheers,

Lancer44

Dani
10-03-2006, 05:56 AM
http://www.gruntsmilitary.com

Edited: And thanks to Lancer and his friend: http://ebsr.net/ESBhistory.htm
http://ebsr.net/3rdESB.htm
http://corregidor.org/chs_2esb/2ndESB.htm

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 11:22 AM
thanks for all of your help, even after the prank. we had no clue of any of this. in a way im glad i did what i did, im learning ALOT.

heres some info from his disscharge papers. ill scan them later but ive got to get directions for the scanner.

place of entry in to service: ft geo meade MD

civilian occupation and no: cloth stockman 8-51-01

education: grammar- 7 highschool- 1 collage-0

decorations and citations:
american theater service medal, asiatic pacific service medal with one bronze service star, philippine liberation service medal, good conduct medal, world war 2 victory metal.

date of seperation: 17 may 46

highest grade held: tec 5

military occupational specialty and no.: lineman telep & telg 238

no wounds received in action.

reasion and authority for spearation: conv of gov rr1-1 demobilization ar 615-365 15 dec 44

service schools attended: grad joint assant sig course fa sch 44

and under remarks: lapel button issued, asr score (2 sep 45) 28

personnel officer: ee davis 2nd lt inf vfm

Lancer44
10-03-2006, 07:12 PM
Hi guyonthesofa,

I just received mail from Greg. He is saying that your great uncle shirt is also unique from another reason.
Above the right pocket there is a badge - something like a bird in a circle.
This badge is officially called "Honorable Discharge Insignia" and unofficially "Ruptured Duck".

This badge entitled discharged soldier to wear his uniform for 90 days without being arrested by MP for illegal usage of US Army uniform.

He had 90 days to buy civvies!
Apparently it was not that easy in States in 1946, when millions of blokes wanted to buy them. Someone my correct me, but I think textiles were still restricted with coupon books.

Cheers,

Lancer44

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 09:09 PM
heres the disscharge papers, there scans of scans the origionals are in a safe place. as soon as we can find the letter from the president ill post it to. what esb group with the 99th signal battalion be with? i know he changed groups sevral times ill try to get the others also.

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521081636.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576071)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521081674.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576072)

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 09:54 PM
can anybody id this jacket? or this mess tin?
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465663.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576376)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465630.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576375)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465653.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576374)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465529.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576373)

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 09:54 PM
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465539.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576372)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465581.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576371)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465544.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576370)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465580.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576369)

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 09:55 PM
hehe, im a garand-a-holic, thats my desk.
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465429.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576368)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465419.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576367)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465799.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576379)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27521465772.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576380)

ww2admin
10-03-2006, 10:14 PM
Wow, nice set up!

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 10:21 PM
thanks, ive been a ww2 nut for a few years now. i started collecting when i was 18. it started with millsurp rifles with a sks and then i found garands. these pictures are old, i only had 2 garands back then lol. any one know what that single shot 22 is at the bottom. ive been told that it was a german training rifle from ww2 called a orkies or something like that but i cant find any other info. i did how ever found out that it was sold in 2 grades for 14 i beleve for the high grade like mine in the late 40s early 50s as millsurp. after the war some were sold as is for 10 i beleve and ones like mine had the stocks checkered and sold for more.

i guess i went overboard.
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27522192871.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576757)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27522204253.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576763)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27522204234.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576762)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27522204250.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576761)

Nickdfresh
10-03-2006, 10:24 PM
This has to be a troll! And an M-1 runs a grand? Ooof, that's pretty steep.

guyonthesofa1989
10-03-2006, 10:30 PM
This has to be a troll! And an M-1 runs a grand? Ooof, that's pretty steep.

you used to get a nice service grade for 500 from cmp but there all out. even when they were 500 you could turn around and sell it for 1000 at a gunshow the day after you recieved it. now that there out of good garands the price is going higher. i was offered 1700 for one of my correct winchesters at a shooting range a few months back i turned it down because ive probably got more than that in the gun making it correct.

hell, ive even got a NM garand with competition stickers from the 60s. and a winchester carbine with a mint stock. the nm is the one with the sticker, there running 2-3k now if i remember correctly. hard to tell what the carbines running for.
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27522293241.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576843)
http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27522293280.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3576844)

mike M.
10-04-2006, 01:06 PM
you used to get a nice service grade for 500 from cmp

My first M1 Garand from the CMP program cost me $160 , the only draw back is it took over a year to receive back then. The two I got were an all original WWII Springfield and A WWII Winchester with a WWII dated springfield barrel. The prices for good CLEAN Garands and carbines is going thru the roof. I turned down $2500 for my 1-43 dated Carbine.

guyonthesofa1989
10-04-2006, 02:32 PM
new finds, my dad came accross a bunch of medals and stuff of his including a wra 44 headstamped carbine round made in to a necklace. ill post those pictures later. you might find this interesting, it was a map that was folded in one of the little boxes. any one know what it is?

http://img1.putfile.com/thumb/10/27614305019.jpg (http://www.putfile.com/pic.php?img=3582501)

Cuts
10-04-2006, 06:32 PM
Well as far as I can make out I don't think it's directons to the Champs-Élysées.




Nice M1s there pal, I swapped a DK model with a mate a year back - it had taken me years to find the precise one I wanted :( - and the D model I bought at the same time isn't as accurate.
Or is it my eyesight that's going ?

guyonthesofa1989
10-04-2006, 06:59 PM
could have been a number of things, they are verry accurite rifles but more than likely the muzzle was wore out from cleaning. the problem is with the m1d is that the barrel is what the mount is screwed in to so if the barrels bad good luck finding a new origional one. theres repro barrels out there with mounts and rear hand guard for 230 bucks. if you want another m1d get that setup and a rack grade from cmp, it would not be origional but it would be a nice shooter m1d clone for cheap.

btw, whats Champs-Élysées. aint that in paris? if so i think ive found a lost peice of history, who knew the japs were gona attack paris lol. as far as i can tell that map is something near japan or the phillipines. ive got some friends at a jap resturant, one in particular who can rear both japanese and some phillipine stuff so ill see what he thinks next time i see him.

Cuts
10-05-2006, 01:45 PM
Cheers for the gen there GOTS, you're right original Model D bbls are harder to find than rocking horse kak, but before I get a repro one I reckon I'll recrown the muzzle.

The map is as you say fom the Top Secret plans to attack Paris, but they got the dates wrong and the original idea to move in on quatorzejuillet came unstuck when they found the place was shut.
Plan B, to act on Nostradamus' predction that "in the year 2000 a flight of man-made birds will arrive from the East and destroy Paris," went pear-shaped when Tojo became frustrated while trying to work out whether to use the Julian, Gregorian or Japanese lunisolar calendar, couldn't remember if it was a leap-year and ended the planning meeting in a haze of saké and Geisha at the local so-plán.

Gutkowski
10-07-2006, 09:38 AM
It's interesting because the patch looks like somehow mirroring the shoulder patch of the Royal Commando.
http://www.warchronicle.com/50th_div/historiantales_wwii/50div_pics.htm

The shirt is a chino most likely a 1941 pattern ,Yes it does have the Engineer Special Brigades patch he was a T/5 Tech 5 grade
The ribbons are from top left Good conduct (red with white stripes) ,Asiatic -Pacific Campaign with a bronze star for participation in the campaign ,
I am stumped on the Top right ribbon ,I have the same one too but I cant find anything on it
Armed Forces Expeditionary Medal (bottom left)
The last one is the World War II Victory ribbon
I cant see the rest of your photos in the post it shows that they are taken off
Hope this helps ,
Gut-

Cutaway
03-27-2007, 09:55 PM
What other kit do you have?

Cuts
06-07-2007, 07:28 AM
It's interesting because the patch looks like somehow mirroring the shoulder patch of the Royal Commando.
http://www.warchronicle.com/50th_div/historiantales_wwii/50div_pics.htm

"Royal Commando" ?
Dani, that site mis-identified the badge, it was used by Combined Operations troops which included soldiers, sailors and airmen.

It's still in use by 148 (Meiktla) Bty RA, (the NGS unit.)

Walther
06-21-2007, 04:19 PM
The map centers on Thailand (Siam, orange), but also shows French Indochina (pink, today thre countries, Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia) plus a bit of Burma. It is marked in Japanese.

Jan

sniper18
07-22-2007, 08:33 PM
ok ok im not going to let this go any farther. this was a joke. i own 9 m1 garands. the "winchester garand" pictured is actually 3 guns a H&R (first garand pictured on the bed), a winchester (reciever picture with photochoped serial number), and a polished SA wall hanger that was assambled from junk parts. i build garands 03s and carbines on the side for fun, i take stripped recievers and make them in to nice firearms with correct parts. me and a buddy pulled this prank on blade forums to frazzle a few friends who post on that site. they are garand NUTS even more so than i am.

the stock however is a unfortunite story, it is a verry rare HR offcenter stock that few were made of before the company lost there contract because the guns were not centered in the stock and actually left part of the rear of the reciever overhanging. the ONLY reasion i used it was because saturday my 1400 correct HR garand blew up because of a double loaded ka headstamped korean surplus ammo. luckly the gun survived unharmed besides the gasses breaking the stock in half longways. after i cut the stock on the saw the only thing holding it togeather was the front band, we had to fix it with school glue. so we could take the pictures. its sence been totaly destroyed. the really bad part is that ive seen rougher counterparts to that stock sell on gun sites for over 500.

i had these guys going pretty good, i thaught they were going to hang me and im sure a few of them would have if they could have gotten there hands on me.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=427098

the uniform and pictures are legit, they actually belonged to my late great uncle. he suffered from shell shock after the war and lived till the mid 80s. in the war he carried a rockola carbine (i know because of the rare I cut stock that he is pictured with)and was certified for a machine gun, im assuming the tommy gun because of the patches on the shirt. he was in and around layte and lazon if im spelling those correctly and was on the battle ship at the surrender, note the pictures in the other forum.

does anyone know what the patches mean?

I thought you ****in serious!!