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HnH
11-28-2005, 03:51 PM
Went? It started wrong, they forgot that it was Russia.

Firefly
11-28-2005, 03:54 PM
LOL, nice first post. But wasnt it the Soviet Union?

Bladensburg
11-28-2005, 05:29 PM
LOL, nice first post. But wasnt it the Soviet Union?

He is a curious dichotomy Firefly, he puts his location as Riga, Soviet Union - - which is of course rightly defunct these days.

HnH
11-29-2005, 10:57 AM
LOL, nice first post. But wasnt it the Soviet Union?
Soviet Union is just a name of the state, the country was Russia. These are quite different things - state and country. And war was not won by goverment, it was won by the soviet people (mainly Russians).

P.S. read the name of this topic.

Firefly
11-29-2005, 11:17 AM
Yep, I see your point many people find the USSR and Russia interchangeable, welcome aboard anyway.

Forgot to mention, went to your site, but obviously I dont read Russian, what does it mean and what does it do, looks interesting though.

HnH
11-29-2005, 04:50 PM
Thanks for welcoming :) The website is a homepage of Latvian internet society. Nothing about ww2 there, just news about soft, games, some interesting social news etc. :)

p.s. Let's keep the topic main question alive :) My opinion that the greatest Hitlers mistake was that he wanted to conquer Russia (SU) the same way as Poland, France etc. Blitzkrieg tactics was uneffective in huge spaces that Russia has, Hilter should have understand that.

Firefly
11-29-2005, 04:54 PM
How do you feel about the fact that in 1939 the Soviets also invaded Poland?

Dani
11-29-2005, 04:58 PM
...and Baltic States in 1940?

Edited: Not to mention the ultimatum given to Romania in 1940 ....

HnH
11-30-2005, 05:04 AM
How do you feel about the fact that in 1939 the Soviets also invaded Poland?

It was Molotov and Ribbentrop's pact, later (in 80s years as I remember) Soviet goverment judged this pact, and asked for excuse.


...and Baltic States in 1940?

Soviet army NEVER invaded baltic states. All 3 goverments voted to join Soviet Union peacefly. Sure there was a pressure from the Soviet goverment that wanted to force them to join the Union, but the fact remains the same - Soviet army NEVER invaded baltic states. It was just geopolical game, we see the same things right now - baltic states have joined NATO, de facto it is nearly the same, that was in 1940.

Cuts
11-30-2005, 05:13 AM
...

Soviet army NEVER invaded baltic states. All 3 goverments voted to join Soviet Union peacefly. Sure there was a pressure from the Soviet goverment that wanted to force them to join the Union, but the fact remains the same - Soviet army NEVER invaded baltic states. It was just geopolical game, we see the same things right now - baltic states have joined NATO, de facto it is nearly the same, that was in 1940.

:lol: :lol: :lol:
Got to love a sense of humour like that !

Man of Stoat
11-30-2005, 05:58 AM
...

Soviet army NEVER invaded baltic states. All 3 goverments voted to join Soviet Union peacefly. Sure there was a pressure from the Soviet goverment that wanted to force them to join the Union, but the fact remains the same - Soviet army NEVER invaded baltic states. It was just geopolical game, we see the same things right now - baltic states have joined NATO, de facto it is nearly the same, that was in 1940.

:lol: :lol: :lol:
Got to love a sense of humour like that !

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupation_of_Baltic_Republics


The spring of 1940 saw the German occupation of Denmark and Norway as well as a blitz through the Low Countries to France. These actions activated Soviet foreign policy towards the Baltic states, this time demanding political concessions: the removal of anti-Soviet elements from governments and free transition (transit?) rights for Red Army personnel. The pressure culminated in demands for new elections. The elections were conducted by local communists loyal to the Soviet Union and all non-communist candidates were disqualified. Outright fraud was also used in some voting places, to hide the fact that parts of the population were boycotting the rigged elections. The result was that all three Baltic states had communist majorities in their parliaments, and in August these three parliaments appealed to the Soviet government to become parts of the Soviet Union. These appeals were satisfied - these republics were annexed to the Soviet Union.

...snip...

In the one year of Soviet occupation, from June 1940 to June 1941, approximately 50,000 people were imprisoned or executed.


I guess that sounds perfectly peaceful if you're a communist sympathiser. However, to most sane people, it sounds treacherous and appalling.

Dani
11-30-2005, 06:45 AM
Comrade HnH, take a look:

http://img495.imageshack.us/img495/1015/800pxribbentropmolotov0kk.png

And also a quotation from wikipedia:
The Soviet Union denied the existence of the secret protocols until 1988, when politburo member Alexander Nikolaevich Yakovlev admitted the existence of the protocols, although the document itself was declassified only after the dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1992.
End quote.

And I never heard of any excuses from the "Soviet Union", Russia or whatever.

Dani
11-30-2005, 06:51 AM
Secret protocol:
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/nazsov/addsepro.htm

And also: http://www.lituanus.org/1989/89_1_03.htm

Dani
11-30-2005, 07:06 AM
Topic splitted.

Twitch1
11-30-2005, 12:12 PM
Let's recap. We had the Soviet Union which was made up of countries or nation states. We got the United States composed of individual states to form a union. So if we're all Americans in the US then the in the old Soviet Union everyone was Soviets. :D 8)

Man of Stoat
11-30-2005, 03:18 PM
Let's recap. We had the Soviet Union which was made up of countries or nation states. We got the United States composed of individual states to form a union. So if we're all Americans in the US then the in the old Soviet Union everyone was Soviets. :D 8)

One was a voluntary union for the benefit of all, the other was a forced union for the benefit of the few. No prizes for guessing which was which...

Firefly
12-01-2005, 02:33 AM
I'm sure the folks in Texas in 1866 didnt share that sentiment!

Man of Stoat
12-01-2005, 02:51 AM
I'm sure the folks in Texas in 1866 didnt share that sentiment!

That leaves the secret police didn't come in and deport or murder tens of thousands of people, including everyone who spoke out against it.