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Hosenfield
11-25-2005, 07:55 PM
Very interesting battle. Studied by military academies worldwide as a very successful conquest of a city by the SS panzer korps (1st SS, 2nd SS, 3rd SS). Probably the last of the really high quality SS troops fought here.

The three divisions II SS panzer korps suffered 11,500 dead , missing, and wounded attacking soviet units, many of them guards, and inflicting 86,569 dead, wounded, and captured among the soviets, as well as destroying 322 tanks, 3,185 artillery pieces inside the City.

The other 110,000 men German units under Manstein, along with the SS destroyed 153,561 soviet troops outside of the city, and destroyed 1,023 russian tanks, 2,106 artillery guns.

the russians also lost 417 aircraft during the 3rd Battle.

the 1st SS achieved much during this battle, while suffered 4,500 causalities it inflicted more then 40,000 on the soviet forces and destroyed 600 tanks in and outside of the city.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e5/LSSAH_Charkow3.jpg

Firefly
11-26-2005, 04:55 AM
What were the dates of the battle mate?

Hosenfield
11-26-2005, 05:08 AM
February 16, 1943–March 15, 1943 It was the last great german offensive victory in world war 2. Its victory opened the conditions required to storm the kursk salent in germany's final all-out offensive.

Gen. Sandworm
11-26-2005, 06:23 AM
February 16, 1943–March 15, 1943 It was the last great german offensive victory in world war 2. Its victory opened the conditions required to storm the kursk salent in germany's final all-out offensive.

On the Eastern Front that is! :wink:

Hosenfield
11-26-2005, 09:02 AM
The Ardennes offensive was not an all-out offensive. Many premier german panzer divisions did not take part in it, like Grossedeuschland panzer division or 3rd SS totenkopft and 5th SS Wiking. All of the Tiger battalions did not take part in the ardennes, except for two.

Gen. Sandworm
11-26-2005, 09:40 AM
The Ardennes offensive was not an all-out offensive. Many premier german panzer divisions did not take part in it, like Grossedeuschland panzer division or 3rd SS totenkopft and 5th SS Wiking. All of the Tiger battalions did not take part in the ardennes, except for two.

It was as all out as they could manages. Its not like they pulled the whole Wehrmacht to the east for the offensive. Then had plently divisions elsewhere in the world. Anyhow depends what you mean by "all out." Think its safe to say that the both were the last great german offensives of the war.

Hosenfield
11-26-2005, 09:48 AM
nope, the ardennes wasn't the last offensive either. The last german offensive was the lake Balaton offension "operation Spring Awakening" led by the SS panzer divisions.

It was 100,000 men smaller then the Ardennes offensive.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Spring_Awakening

Gen. Sandworm
11-26-2005, 12:58 PM
nope, the ardennes wasn't the last offensive either. The last german offensive was the lake Balaton offension "operation Spring Awakening" led by the SS panzer divisions.

It was 100,000 men smaller then the Ardennes offensive.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Spring_Awakening

Hadnt heard of that one before. Good Post.

Hosenfield
11-26-2005, 01:21 PM
The commander of 6th Army, SS general Sepp Dietrich said to hitler after the failure of the offensive.
"My army is well named. In my 6th Army lies six tanks!"