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Tsolias
09-28-2005, 02:54 PM
EU tells Turkey to recognise genocide
The European Parliament in Strasbourg has given its backing to EU membership talks with Turkey due to start next week. However in a non-binding resolution EU parliamentarians demanded that Ankara recognise the genocide of Armenians under Ottoman rule in 1915 as a precondition for joining the EU. The controversial issue has become a major stumbling block with Turkey refusing to accept the killing of 1.5 million Armenians as genocide. At a press conference in Strasbourg Turkey's foreign minister indicated that his country may shun the accession talks if it is offered anything less than full EU membership.

www.dw-world.de

Sturmtruppen
09-28-2005, 09:08 PM
Well,in argentina there are a million of armenians (the biggest armenian comunity in the world) and they don't like turks as turks don't like them.
but maybe the turks have their arguments,we have to hear both sides before having a thinking,no?

Greetings!

Tsolias
09-29-2005, 05:38 AM
Im sure that the Turks have their side of the story but as long as The European Parliament in Strasbourg (along with the majority of the countries in this small world) says that the genocide happened-then i dont think their mind matters.

Firefly
09-29-2005, 09:30 AM
Are there any other countries aspiring to EU membership that have a similar bad mark?

Dani
09-29-2005, 10:14 AM
Are there any other countries aspiring to EU membership that have a similar bad mark?

http://europa.eu.int/abc/maps/index_en.htm shows for candidate countries Bulgaria, Croatia, Romania and Turkey.

http://www.europarl.eu.int/enlargement/default_en.htm (European Parliament shows as candidate countries Bulgaria, Romania and Turkey.

On 25 April 2005, Romania and Bulgaria signed their Treaty of Accession to the European Union. The objective now is its ratification, so that Romania and Bulgaria can become Member States of the European Union on 1 January 2007.

Also some potential candidates are Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia and Serbia and Montenegro including Kosovo, according to
http://europa.eu.int/scadplus/leg/en/lvb/r18008.htm

Edited: For sure on Romania and Bulgaria wasn't any bad mark of such kind.

Tsolias
09-29-2005, 11:44 AM
Are there any other countries aspiring to EU membership that have a similar bad mark?

Genocide?
No.

Crab_to_be
09-29-2005, 01:38 PM
Having organised or participated in genocides is no bar to EU membership in itself though. I think one of the countries between Poland and France can attest to that.

Tsolias
09-29-2005, 03:00 PM
Having organised or participated in genocides is no bar to EU membership in itself though. I think one of the countries between Poland and France can attest to that.

At least they do recognise that it happened.

Crab_to_be
09-29-2005, 03:30 PM
True. The first I knew of the Armenian Genocide was from an Armenian friend.

I'm a fan of Turkish membership of the EU as I think that Turkey and the EU can both benefit from it. That the debate on the Armenian genocide is now diplomatically possible is an example of this.

Tsolias
09-29-2005, 04:35 PM
Anyway i think that they aint goin to be accepted if they dont do something about Cyprus and Kurdistan.
By the way does anybody know when Turkey declared war to Germany in WWII?
:twisted:

pdf27
09-29-2005, 04:59 PM
Anyway i think that they aint goin to be accepted if they dont do something about Cyprus and Kurdistan.
By the way does anybody know when Turkey declared war to Germany in WWII?
:twisted:
May 1945?
In any case, they have done a hell of a lot about both Cyprus and the Kurdish areas. Just about every time the EU has said "jump" in the past few years the Turkish response has been "how high".
As for Cyprus, the blame for it currently being divided lies squarely with the Greek Cypriots - and the EU is well aware of this. There was a reunification deal on the table, backed by the Greek and Turkish governments, the EU and UN. The Turkish Cypriots narrowly accepted it, despite it being recognised by all the outside parties that they were going to lose far more from the deal. The Greek Cypriots rejected it, because they thought they could get more. The EU as a whole was hopping mad, but rather happy with the way Turkey behaved.

Tsolias
09-29-2005, 06:25 PM
May 1945?

Hell yeah.
Wasn't it brave?



In any case, they have done a hell of a lot about both Cyprus and the Kurdish areas. Just about every time the EU has said "jump" in the past few years the Turkish response has been "how high".


Of course they did.
If i steal your wallet and then somebody says to me:"you cant keep all these money you know! You got to give some back."
I'll be jumping too.



As for Cyprus, the blame for it currently being divided lies squarely with the Greek Cypriots - and the EU is well aware of this. There was a reunification deal on the table, backed by the Greek and Turkish governments, the EU and UN.


True.


The Turkish Cypriots narrowly accepted it, despite it being recognised by all the outside parties that they were going to lose far more from the deal. The Greek Cypriots rejected it, because they thought they could get more. The EU as a whole was hopping mad, but rather happy with the way Turkey behaved.

Its always hard to accept an invader as equal.

Iron Yeoman
09-29-2005, 06:33 PM
Though, the Turk cypriots aren't invaders, having lived in Cyprus i managed to glean that Cypriot Turks & Greeks lived quite happily together until 1974, both groups have been on the island for hundreds of years, hardly invaders.

Tsolias
09-29-2005, 06:44 PM
Though, the Turk cypriots aren't invaders, having lived in Cyprus i managed to glean that Cypriot Turks & Greeks lived quite happily together until 1974, both groups have been on the island for hundreds of years, hardly invaders.

True but i was reffering to all this Turks that have been brought to Northern Cyprus after 1974 in order to live in the emty houses/villages and grow the number of muslim inhabitants on the island.

Iron Yeoman
09-30-2005, 03:45 AM
Again fair point, but they've been there around thirty years now, surely it's time to stop thinking of them as invaders and start thinking of them as immigrants, surely thats the only way to bring peace to Cyprus, and finally unite it? Surely it'd be better to live alongside the turks again rather than the current situation?

Tsolias
09-30-2005, 05:20 AM
Again fair point, but they've been there around thirty years now, surely it's time to stop thinking of them as invaders and start thinking of them as immigrants, surely thats the only way to bring peace to Cyprus, and finally unite it?

An invader is always an invader.
Thirty years is a short period for these wounds to heal.
Mothers who lost their children in the invasion are still alive.


Surely it'd be better to live alongside the turks again rather than the current situation?


No.
Thats the whole point.
To live alongside with the Turkish Cypriots is acceptable.
To live alongside with the mainland Turk invaders in equal terms-its out of the question for every Greek Cyprian.

Dani
09-30-2005, 05:49 AM
An invader is always an invader.
Thirty years is a short period for these wounds to heal.
Mothers who lost their children in the invasion are still alive.

Tsolias, I disagree with your affirmation. It is subjective and not objective. Think about the Allies and the Germany (West one) or US in Japan (better). Mothers who lost their children in the invasion were still alive in 1975 (speaking of thirty years).

Was that invaders felt as invaders by Germans and by Japanese? I'm afraid not.

And speaking of Greek Cypriots / "Turk Cypriots colonists" are they so incompatible like Palestinians / Jewish colonists?

Maybe with that withdrawal from Gaza, the same solution will be discussed amongst EU and UN. Or maybe not. Will see!

Tsolias
09-30-2005, 06:11 AM
Tsolias, I disagree with your affirmation. It is subjective and not objective. Think about the Allies and the Germany (West one) or US in Japan (better). Mothers who lost their children in the invasion were still alive in 1975 (speaking of thirty years).

Was that invaders felt as invaders by Germans and by Japanese? I'm afraid not.

Well the differnce is that Greek Cypriots never started a war.



And speaking of Greek Cypriots / "Turk Cypriots colonists" are they so incompatible like Palestinians / Jewish colonists?

Oh yeah.



Maybe with that withdrawal from Gaza, the same solution will be discussed amongst EU and UN. Or maybe not. Will see!

That would be the best IMHO.

Dani
09-30-2005, 06:19 AM
Well the differnce is that Greek Cypriots never started a war.

True :oops:

Firefly
09-30-2005, 06:33 AM
As everything there are always more than one side to stories. I rather think that the mainland Greek government had a wee hand in it too.

http://www.onwar.com/aced/data/tango/turkeycyprus1974.htm

Nice little link above.... Just bare facts but gives a diffrent slant to Cyprus.

Dani
09-30-2005, 06:52 AM
Quite interesting things about another war involving Cyprus:
http://www.regiments.org/wars/20thcent/55cyprus.htm


A good ovierview for Cyprus could be http://countrystudies.us/cyprus/

Dani
09-30-2005, 07:31 AM
Quite interesting things about another war involving Cyprus:
http://www.regiments.org/wars/20thcent/55cyprus.htm
[/url]

Quoted:
In 1915 Britain offered to cede Cyprus to Greece in return for their entry into the war against the Central Powers, but Greece considered the price too great as they expected a German victory.
End quote.
:!: Pure history.

Firefly
09-30-2005, 08:27 AM
Good sites, just goes to show how complicated things really are in the world. And a lot of the problems were indeed as a direct result of my countries involvement. Ah the Empire, a lot to answer for there.