View Full Version : Black RAF Aircrew in WW2

03-14-2013, 06:08 AM
Hi. I am doing research for an author on the history of black volunteer aircrew in the RAF during WW2. Can anyone tell me anything about this or point me somewhere? I canít find a lot online but we know that over 400 of these men existed! Thanks :)

03-14-2013, 08:14 PM
All RAF aircrew were volunteers, & the RAF accepted them from all over the Commonwealth/Empire,but by 'black' - what do you mean?
Australian Aborigines, West Indian "coloureds", Southern Indian dark skinned Asians, Pacific Islanders, Idi Amin?

05-17-2013, 02:54 PM
Finding about black volunteer aircrew that served in the RAF shouldnt be too difficult...i remember reading an article about a black tail gunner who's lancaster got shot down over warsaw during the polish uprising; who unfortunately survived the parachute jump but was shot by the germans within a short space of time.

05-17-2013, 05:12 PM
Hi. I am doing research for an author on the history of black volunteer aircrew in the RAF during WW2. Can anyone tell me anything about this or point me somewhere? I can’t find a lot online but we know that over 400 of these men existed! Thanks :)
There are some seriously good researchers on this board. If you're willing to pay them to do your job for you, I'm sure they'd be willing to help...

05-17-2013, 06:56 PM
The class oriented toffs of the RAF used to refer [somewhat sneeringly, if possibly enviously] to Commonwealth aircrew
as 'coloured troops'..& Dambuster Guy Gibson had 'Nigger',[his black Labrador] but he was ground crew..

05-18-2013, 11:12 AM
The dog was a member of the canine family:nothing else!

05-18-2013, 06:11 PM
Canine - for sure, but 'Nigger' was the Skipper's pet, & code name for the successful dam attack..

05-19-2013, 09:57 AM
Not talking about the name of the dog talking about the ability you attached to the dog.

Rising Sun*
05-19-2013, 10:31 AM
There are some seriously good researchers on this board. If you're willing to pay them to do your job for you, I'm sure they'd be willing to help...

I could find a few sites dealing with this issue in about ten seconds.

The author needs a better researcher.

Like me, at AU$2,500 per relevant site found. Or discounted to AU$6,000 for every three sites found. And AU$100,000 per living black RAF member found (excluding dogs of any breed called Nigger, which are discounted to AU$2,500 if genuine black Labrador and AU$250 if not genuine but reasonable facsimile thereof).

All cash via Paypal, Visa or Mastercard. No Bitcoin.

05-19-2013, 06:15 PM
Well, that's putting your shingle out.. good on ya RS..

& I'm pretty sure ol' 'Nigger' was not aircrew/flying,
even on the low-level stuff where breathing/cold issues weren't big..

Rising Sun*
05-20-2013, 09:49 AM
Well, that's putting your shingle out.. good on ya RS..

If they buy in the next 24 hours, I'll throw in a set of steak knives. ;)

& I'm pretty sure ol' 'Nigger' was not aircrew/flying,
even on the low-level stuff where breathing/cold issues weren't big..

I think N****r flew on some non-combat flights with Guy Gibson, but N****r is about to be airbrushed out of popular history, the same way Enid Blyton's G*******s were removed to avoid offending people who identified with black rag dolls (which I think was highly discriminatory against people called Teddy who werenít afforded the same protection by banning vastly more numerous Teddy bears).

Fur flies over racist name of Dambuster's dog

The multimillion-pound remake of the film The Dambusters has become mired in a debate about political correctness over the name of a major character's dog.

By Paul Chapman in Wellington

1:00AM BST 06 May 2009

Nigger, a black Labrador, was Wing Commander Guy Gibson's faithful companion and the mascot of the RAF's 617 Squadron, which carried out the successful 1943 bouncing bomb raid on Germany's Ruhr dams.

Peter Jackson, the New Zealander who is producing the remake of the 1954 epic starring Richard Todd, is known to be passionate about remaining faithful to the authentic details of the story.

But others working on the blockbuster, which is backed by Hollywood studios and has a £ 26 million budget, are insisting that the dog's name is too racially offensive, particularly in the crucial United States market.

Nigger was mentioned 12 times in the original, and also featured prominently in the book by Paul Brickhill, published three years earlier, on which the film was based.

Stephen Fry, the actor who is writing the new script, was asked to come up with alternative names for Nigger.

But Sir David Frost, the executive producer, is reported to have rejected all the options Fry offered.

Sir David has been quoted as saying: "Guy sometimes used to call his dog Nigsy, so I think that's what we will call it.

"Stephen has been coming up with other names but this is the one I want."

Matthew Dravitzki, Jackson's executive assistant, said this week: "A lot of people have said that the dog's name was Nigger and, to stay true to the story, you can't just change it."

He told Wellington's Dominion-Post newspaper: "That name is talked about a lot, but we have not made any decision yet.

"The script is still being written and that decision on whether we have Nigger or not will be made closer to the time."

Jackson, who has a collection of Second World War aeroplanes and memorabilia, originally sought to make the film because of his interest in the subject.

He said, when announcing his plans in 2006: "It is not our intention to offend people. But really you are in a no-win, damned-if-you-do and damned-if-you-don't scenario.

"If you change it, everyone's going to whinge and whine about political correctness. And if you don't change it, obviously you are offending a lot of people inadvertently."

In most recent television reshowings of the 1954 film, the dog's name is either edited out or altered.

An edited version for American television has Nigger's name redubbed as Trigger.

My emphasis penultimate sentence. Morons!


Rising Sun*
05-20-2013, 09:51 AM
However, the latest solution is to make the dog an Australian soldier, which makes sense to the politically correct ****wits who inform popular culture by their corruptions of history in pursuit of the entertainment dollar.

Dambusters dog to be renamed Digger for remake of iconic film... because N-word might offend Americans

By Daily Mail Reporter
UPDATED: 19:17 GMT, 10 June 2011

The Dambusters dog N****r will be renamed Digger for a modern remake of the iconic film to avoid offending American viewers, it has emerged.

Script writer Stephen Fry, 53, has confirmed that pilot Guy Gibson's faithful black Labrador will be renamed for the forthcoming Peter Jackson movie.

In the original 1955 film Gibson's dog's name was spoken 12 times as a code word to report successful dam breaches to RAF Bomber Command.
Offensive: Actor Richard Todd as Wing Commander Guy Gibson and his dog N*gger in the classic film, The Dambusters

Offensive: Actor Richard Todd as Wing Commander Guy Gibson and his dog N*gger in the classic film, The Dambusters

But Fry, who is writing the script for the long-awaited remake, has revealed he will now be renamed Digger to avoid offending American viewers.

He said: 'There is no question in America that you could ever have a dog called the N-word.

'It's no good saying that it is the Latin word for black or that it didn't have the meaning that it does now - you just can't go back, which is unfortunate.

'You can go to RAF Scampton and see the dog's grave and there he is with his name, and it's an important part of the film.

'The name of the dog was a code word to show that the dam had been successfully breached.

'You just can't go back': Stephen Fry, left, is writing the script for the remake of The Dambusters, which Peter Jackson, right, will direct

'In the film, you're constantly hearing 'n-word, n-word, n-word, hurray' and Barnes Wallis is punching the air.

'But obviously that's not going to happen now. So Digger seems okay, I reckon.'

The iconic 1955 film tells the story of British Second World War scientists who developed a bouncing bomb as a means of attacking Germany's dams.

During the film a special squadron of Lancaster bombers, 617 Squadron, is formed and trained by Wing Commander Guy Gibson.

His black Labrador dog N*gger is present throughout the film and his name repeatedly used as a code word to report successful breaches of dams.

But when Peter Jackson began planning a remake of the historic film, which has been scripted by Fry, the team agreed to rename him Digger.

N*gger died in a car accident on the morning of the Dambusters raid on 16 May 1943 and is buried at the squadron's home of RAF Scampton, Lincs.

The move has attracted criticism from historians and aviation enthusiasts who have revealed they are 'unhappy' with the alteration.

Mervyn Hallam, curator of RAF Scampton museum, today slammed the change and accused Fry of trying to 'rewrite history'.

He said: 'It's not a problem with coloured people it's the people in power creating the problem. Sod their political correctness and sod human rights.

'They should keep the dog's name the same - it's ridiculous that they are trying to rewrite history. His grave is still here with his name on it.

'What they are trying to do is dishonouring N*gger and dishonouring the brave men who flew that mission.

'We have over 9,000 visitors a year at RAF Scampton and many of them are not native to England but none of them are offended.

'N*gger is the name of the dog and that shouldn't be interfered with. In the context of the time and the film it's not a racist name.'

Jim Shortland, a historian who specialises in the Dambusters, added: 'I'm unhappy with the change because it's sacrificing historical accuracy for political correctness, in particular for the American market.

'If someone was offended by Guy Gibson's name you wouldn't go around calling him Richard Todd.

'One wonders what else the film might get wrong. Once you know something is incorrect, you're going to be suspicious.'

But Phil Bonner, spokesman for Aviation Heritage Lincolnshire, admitted the name of the dog is 'very emotive'.

He said: 'The name of the dog is very emotive for many people and in some respects it's a reflection of the changes that have happened across the generations.

'The whole core of the film is about the bravery of the people who flew from Lincolnshire on a very daring raid and it's important that this aspect of the film is not watered down.'

I like Stephen Fry’s work over many years, but I’m afraid his willingness to mislead and deceive in this instance suggests that he hasn’t learned much since he did prison time many years ago for fraud.

This N****r bullshit is the same sort that saw the N****r Brown stand renamed to avoid offending black people, with total insensitivity to the feelings of brown people who are still oppressed by the new name.

'Nigger Brown' stand gone, Coon cheese next on hit-list
David Barbeler | September 26, 2008 - 12:54PM

An anti-racism campaigner says Coon cheese is next on his hit-list after the Queensland government ruled a controversial grandstand being rebuilt in the state's south would not be renamed after E.S. "Nigger" Brown.

Toowoomba Sports Ground Trust chairman John McDonald yesterday told AAP that while the grandstand bearing Brown's name was to be demolished in coming days as part of an upgrade, the "N word" would be used on a plaque or statue at the new ground.

But late yesterday, Sports Minister Judy Spence ruled it would be inappropriate to use the racist term in any way.

Ms Spence said she had talked to Mr McDonald, and he agreed the word would not be used at all.

"I do not want the next generation of Queenslanders thinking that using the word nigger is acceptable," she said.

Toowoomba academic Stephen Hagan, who campaigned against the name for almost a decade and even took his case to the United Nations, said his celebrations would be shortlived.

Mr Hagan said he would now focus his time and effort on fighting Dairy Farmers' Coon cheese.

"Initially, Dairy Farmers said it was named after Edward Coon, who revolutionised the speeding process of making cheese," he told AAP.

"But I've questioned the authenticity of that story."

Formerly manufactured by Kraft, Mr Hagan claims the cheese used to have a black wraparound and was named Coon as a joke.

"I want Dairy Farmers to show me the evidence of Edward Coon being honoured an honorary doctorate and what year he received that honorary doctorate," he said.

"If they can prove to me that Edward Coon was a famous cheesemaker, I will drop my campaign.

"If they can't do it, I'm going to fight them all the way, just like I did with Nigger Brown."

Mr Hagan said Ms Spence's decision to ban the word nigger from the Toowoomba Sports Ground was unexpected.

"I've fought this campaign for nine years and all reports made yesterday made some indication that (nigger) would still appear somewhere," Mr Hagan told AAP.

"I fought the (Toowoomba Sports Ground Trust) in all the courts and they have not once given me one indication that they would be flexible in any way."

Mr McDonald today said the contributions of former local councillor and Kangaroos representative Edward Stanley Brown would be recognised in an "appropriate" way.

"That sign was built in the 1960s ... that wasn't yesterday," Mr McDonald told AAP.

Edward Stanley Brown was of Anglo-Saxon descent, and it is said he was nicknamed "Nigger" because of his fair complexion or after a brand of shoe polish.

So, if this sort of modern politically correct bullshit is extended to Guy Gibson's dog, now renamed Nigsy or Trigger or Digger or Flopsy or Mopsy or Cottontail or What-****ing-ever, what are they going to do with the headstone on his grave?

Stupid bastards!

from http://ww2discovery.net/raf-scampton-home-of-the-dambusters/

05-20-2013, 06:41 PM
"Gnasher" maybe, or "Spooky","Chalky", "Honky" or some ironic twist?

Perhaps if Barnes Wallis is played by Samuel L. Jackson, he could get away with using the authentic "Nigger"?

Rising Sun*
05-21-2013, 11:58 AM
"Gnasher" maybe, or "Spooky","Chalky", "Honky" or some ironic twist?

Perhaps if Barnes Wallis is played by Samuel L. Jackson, he could get away with using the authentic "Nigger"?

That should work.

And Guy Gibson could be played by Snoop Dogg, with the film's theme Snoop's immortal chorus as the bombers fly over the dam

You's a nigga when you born,
a nigga when you dyin
Nigga quit lyin
you's a nigga for life
You's a nigga when you ridin,
a nigga when you sidin
Nigga quit tryin you's a nigga for life
You can paint your face and change your nose and buy new clothes
But you know what... You cant change who the **** you are
You's a mother****ing nigga for life

Unless, of course, the nigga happens to be a black labrador called N****r, which might have been a nigga for life, but is now to be whitewashed.

This absurd cinematic corruption of history should be carried further into the idiotic modern world by having N****r played by Rin Tin Tin, representing German Alsatians as an inclusive gesture to the Germans. The dam should be a sanctuary for whales whose navigational systems are profoundly upset by the humans' sea war and its awful effects on sea life (there's no need to explain how whales got that far inland - this is Hollywood). The whales are protected by greenies inhabiting and protecting the forests surrounding the dam, but unfortunately they don't have anti-aircraft lights or weapons. Their angry but impotent shaking of faint fists in the dark at the bombers symbolises the powerlessness of mankind (and whales and trees) against machines. Properly done, this will be a great moment in cinema. To avoid environmental damage, the dam will be represented by a small fish pond made from a toddler's plastic wading pool bought from KMart. Its pathetically thin walls will not be breached to ensure that the whales don't get beached (I know that whales won't fit in fish ponds / wading pools - this is Hollywood). The bombs will just cause small ripples on the surface, symbolising the great damage downstream, a bit like the beach scene with Burt Lancaster and Deborah Kerr in From Here To Eternity symbolised another massive explosion downstream. The bombers making the raid will be Italian flown by Japanese pilots to avoid any suggestion that the film is discriminatory towards any of our former enemies. The closing scenes will be a real tear jerker, with Rin Tin Tin morphing into one of the whales beached on the bed of the empty dam, saying plaintively "I am not an animal. I am a human being." Then an SS NCO, in an SS uniform which is all white, a la Goering on the piss, to avoid offending people upset by black, climbs on top of the whale, draws his Luger, and says "No, you're just an overweight mammal, English pigdog.", points it down the whale's blowhole and pulls the trigger, resulting in a massive and bloody explosion representing man's inhumanity to really big mammals as well as all other mammals, notably his own kind. Product placement requires scrolling under scene "Luger - for when you really want to **** up endangered species. Ask any Jew on the wrong end of one 1933 - 45." . Roll credits to Life of Brian song "Always look on the bright side of life".

I need to work in a Bollywood dance scene somewhere, possibly with Hitler etc in the bunker 1945 ending in mass suicide of men, women and children (okay, the children were murdered by their parents, but that would be a real downer in a happy, uplifting dance scene showing the Nazis as a bunch of fun guys still upset by the deaths of the whales in the Dambuster raid).

05-21-2013, 06:33 PM
Damn, fella - you're good, best get that synopsis to Quentin T, quick-smart..

Oh & he & Dave Chappelle can play Aussie 'pathfinder' Bennett & his Kiwi side-kick
for the authentic ANZAC flavour...