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Nickdfresh
06-22-2012, 03:15 PM
C.I.A. Said to Aid in Steering Arms to Syrian Opposition
By ERIC SCHMITT
Published: June 21, 2012

WASHINGTON — A small number of C.I.A. officers are operating secretly in southern Turkey, helping allies decide which Syrian opposition fighters across the border will receive arms to fight the Syrian government, according to American officials and Arab intelligence officers.
Related

The weapons, including automatic rifles, rocket-propelled grenades, ammunition and some antitank weapons, are being funneled mostly across the Turkish border by way of a shadowy network of intermediaries including Syria’s Muslim Brotherhood and paid for by Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar, the officials said.

The C.I.A. officers have been in southern Turkey for several weeks, in part to help keep weapons out of the hands of fighters allied with Al Qaeda or other terrorist groups, one senior American official said. The Obama administration has said it is not providing arms to the rebels, but it has also acknowledged that Syria’s neighbors would do so.

The clandestine intelligence-gathering effort is the most detailed known instance of the limited American support for the military campaign against the Syrian government. It is also part of Washington’s attempt to increase the pressure on President Bashar al-Assad of Syria, who has recently escalated his government’s deadly crackdown on civilians and the militias battling his rule. With Russia blocking more aggressive steps against the Assad government, the United States and its allies have instead turned to diplomacy and aiding allied efforts to arm the rebels to force Mr. Assad from power.

By helping to vet rebel groups, American intelligence operatives in Turkey hope to learn more about a growing, changing opposition network inside of Syria and to establish new ties. “C.I.A. officers are there and they are trying to make new sources and recruit people,” said one Arab intelligence official who is briefed regularly by American counterparts.

American officials and retired C.I.A. officials said the administration was also weighing additional assistance to rebels, like providing satellite imagery and other detailed intelligence on Syrian troop locations and movements. The administration is also considering whether to help the opposition set up a rudimentary intelligence service. But no decisions have been made on those measures or even more aggressive steps, like sending C.I.A. officers into Syria itself, they said.

The struggle inside Syria has the potential to intensify significantly in coming months as powerful new weapons are flowing to both the Syrian government and opposition fighters. President Obama and his top aides are seeking to pressure Russia to curb arms shipments like attack helicopters to Syria, its main ally in the Middle East.

“We’d like to see arms sales to the Assad regime come to an end, because we believe they’ve demonstrated that they will only use their military against their own civilian population,” Benjamin J. Rhodes, deputy national security adviser for strategic communications, said after Mr. Obama and his Russian counterpart, Vladimir V. Putin, met in Mexico on Monday.

Spokesmen for the White House, State Department and C.I.A. would not comment on any intelligence operations supporting the Syrian rebels, some details of which were reported last week by The Wall Street Journal.

Until now, the public face of the administration’s Syria policy has largely been diplomacy and humanitarian aid.

The State Department said Wednesday that Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton would meet with her Russian counterpart, Sergey V. Lavrov, on the sidelines of a meeting of Asia-Pacific foreign ministers in St. Petersburg, Russia, next Thursday. The private talks are likely to focus, at least in part, on the crisis in Syria.

The State Department has authorized $15 million in nonlethal aid, like medical supplies and communications equipment, to civilian opposition groups in Syria.

The Pentagon continues to fine-tune a range of military options, after a request from Mr. Obama in early March for such contingency planning. Gen. Martin E. Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told senators at that time that the options under review included humanitarian airlifts, aerial surveillance of the Syrian military, and the establishment of a no-fly zone.

The military has also drawn up plans for how coalition troops would secure Syria’s sizable stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons if an all-out civil war threatened their security.

But senior administration officials have underscored in recent days that they are not actively considering military options. “Anything at this point vis-à-vis Syria would be hypothetical in the extreme,” General Dempsey told reporters this month.

What has changed since March is an influx of weapons and ammunition to the rebels. The increasingly fierce air and artillery assaults by the government are intended to counter improved coordination, tactics and weaponry among the opposition forces, according to members of the Syrian National Council and other activists.

Last month, these activists said, Turkish Army vehicles delivered antitank weaponry to the border, where it was then smuggled into Syria. Turkey has repeatedly denied it was extending anything other than humanitarian aid to the opposition, mostly via refugee camps near the border. The United States, these activists said, was consulted about these weapons transfers.

American military analysts offered mixed opinions on whether these arms have offset the advantages held by the militarily superior Syrian Army. “The rebels are starting to crack the code on how to take out tanks,” said Joseph Holliday, a former United States Army intelligence officer in Afghanistan who is now a researcher tracking the Free Syrian Army for the Institute for the Study of War in Washington.

But a senior American officer who receives classified intelligence reports from the region, compared the rebels’ arms to “peashooters” against the government’s heavy weaponry and attack helicopters.

The Syrian National Council, the main opposition group in exile, has recently begun trying to organize the scattered, localized units that all fight under the name of the Free Syrian Army into a more cohesive force.

About 10 military coordinating councils in provinces across the country are now sharing tactics and other information. The city of Homs is the notable exception. It lacks such a council because the three main military groups in the city do not get along, national council officials said.

Jeffrey White, a defense analyst at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy who tracks videos and announcements from self-described rebel battalions, said there were now about 100 rebel formations, up from roughly 70 two months ago, ranging in size from a handful of fighters to a couple of hundred combatants.

“When the regime wants to go someplace and puts the right package of forces together, it can do it,” Mr. White said. “But the opposition is raising the cost of those kinds of operations.”

Neil MacFarquhar contributed reporting from Beirut, Lebanon. Souad Mekhennet also contributed reporting.

NYTimes.com (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/21/world/middleeast/cia-said-to-aid-in-steering-arms-to-syrian-rebels.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all)

turkishwolf
06-28-2012, 02:38 PM
Thats true but Usa forces to Turkey for helping to aid syrian opposition.
You are an american right man? So you should know that project as call Big Middle east Project?
For make this project real Usa supported Turkish goverment and their neo light islamic party. This political party is goverment for 11 years and they changed Turkey's chemistry. I hope u understand what i meant. We become enemy with all of our neighbours.(Syria, Iraq, Iran...) So who is guilty? I really dont know...

Nickdfresh
06-29-2012, 09:03 AM
Yes I am an American and am somewhat vaguely aware of Turkish politics. But a Syrian gov't using heavy military weapons on its own people and population centers cannot be right...

turkishwolf
06-29-2012, 10:15 AM
Yes I am an American and am somewhat vaguely aware of Turkish politics. But a Syrian gov't using heavy military weapons on its own people and population centers cannot be right...

If you are an american then you should know better than me about usa aim over syrian?
Thats clearly open Usa wants a war against to syrian.Okay i can understand that coz this act is not new for me but they want to use Turkey for syrian war. Coz this is part of big project. After syrian next goal is iran then Turkey. So i dont want my country use by usa but cant do anything coz my goverment is slave of Usa...

Nickdfresh
06-29-2012, 11:01 AM
If you are an american then you should know better than me about usa aim over syrian?

A lot of it is public opinion driven after seeing images of massacred Syrian dissidents in cities like Homs. Most people, even those like me who do not favor direct involvement, don't like to sit by and watch ethnic majorities get slaughtered by their ethnic minority regimes... IMHO


Thats clearly open Usa wants a war against to syrian.

Then why are we not at war? The Assad regime of thugs has certainly provided enough pretext.


Okay i can understand that coz this act is not new for me but they want to use Turkey for syrian war.

That's interesting, because it seems to be your gov't that has done the most to aid the Free Syrian Army as well as the refugees. It's the Turkish gov't that has called on NATO to respond to the downing of one of its RF-4's and repeated attempts to bring down other Turkish aircraft not flying in Syrian airspace. The US's/NATO's response has been rather tepid actually...


Coz this is part of big project. After syrian next goal is iran then Turkey. So i dont want my country use by usa but cant do anything coz my goverment is slave of Usa...

I can't answer conspiracy speculations devoid of any evidence when indeed there is quite the evidence to the contrary. But you'll believe what you want to believe nevertheless...

As for your gov't being a "slave" to the US, I can assure you that there was a very nervous mood here when the "Neo-Islamicist" gov't was first elected--hardly "our" choice for a modern European nations' gov't...

turkishwolf
06-29-2012, 12:07 PM
War will start after american elections.
So do you think that why did syrian start to kill some people in syrian without any reason? It started almost one year ago, but before one year in syrian there were no crime as today? Maybe we have to ask Turkey and USA.

You think that Turkey acts freely about Syrian? Wish you could know more about usa - Turkey relationships....
Turkish goverment and their syrian politica felt down, we all saw how did they act cowardly.Its not surprising for me. But i know that our prime minister met obama in south korea few months ago and obama said that war after elections.

I think you dont know alot about Neo Islamic?
Well, there is a big muslim congregation in Turkey. They are strange. They have thousands school over the world. From asia, till america. From africa, till europe.But their acts, clothes, ideas as modern people. U cant understand their islamic or no. Their leader lives in pensilvania in usa. His name is Fethullah Gülen. He started dialogue between all religions 20 years ago. He is best friend with pope, jews congregation. He supported to Usa about iraq war. He supported to Israel, when israel soldiers raided to Turkish sheep and killed 9 men. So he is as a puzzle and alot of people think that he is puppet of usa. So this is neo islam.... It means they look as muslim but they act as any other religion member or opposite to islam.

If you want information i can tell you.
Really things are here so strange.
Greetings from Turkey...

Chevan
07-01-2012, 02:15 PM
Thats clearly open Usa wants a war against to syrian.Okay i can understand that coz this act is not new for me but they want to use Turkey for syrian war. Coz this is part of big project. After syrian next goal is iran then Turkey. .
Seems you know a theme...I think you are right.

turkishwolf
07-01-2012, 02:48 PM
Seems you know a theme...I think you are right.

Its great to see someone agree with me :)
Are u from Russia?

Nickdfresh
07-01-2012, 04:25 PM
Seems you know a theme...I think you are right.

Russia wants a US/NATO war against Syria, for the spike in arms sales that the Syrians are using to massacre their civilian population...

Nickdfresh
07-01-2012, 04:31 PM
War will start after american elections.
So do you think that why did syrian start to kill some people in syrian without any reason? It started almost one year ago, but before one year in syrian there were no crime as today? Maybe we have to ask Turkey and USA.

Which war? Against Syria or Iran? Actually, growing public opinion is favoring a more interventionist course...


You think that Turkey acts freely about Syrian? Wish you could know more about usa - Turkey relationships....
Turkish goverment and their syrian politica felt down, we all saw how did they act cowardly.Its not surprising for me. But i know that our prime minister met obama in south korea few months ago and obama said that war after elections.

Based on what? It seems the Turkish gov't was supporting the Syrian dissidents/refugees/rebels before the USA was. It's your border after all, not ours. Incidentally, if the Turkish gov't supposedly acts as a puppet of the US, then why has there been quite a bit of tension between the gov'ts over the Kurds in Northern Iraq and Turkish military incursions there that were clearly unwelcome in American quarters...


I think you dont know alot about Neo Islamic?

Okay. Tell me how they are supposedly puppets of the US then....


Well, there is a big muslim congregation in Turkey. They are strange. They have thousands school over the world. From asia, till america. From africa, till europe.But their acts, clothes, ideas as modern people. U cant understand their islamic or no. Their leader lives in pensilvania in usa. His name is Fethullah Gülen. He started dialogue between all religions 20 years ago. He is best friend with pope, jews congregation. He supported to Usa about iraq war. He supported to Israel, when israel soldiers raided to Turkish sheep and killed 9 men. So he is as a puzzle and alot of people think that he is puppet of usa. So this is neo islam.... It means they look as muslim but they act as any other religion member or opposite to islam.

Seems to be a rather strange connection since the US gov't clearly wanted the Islamist parties to lose...


If you want information i can tell you.
Really things are here so strange.
Greetings from Turkey...

That's okay, greetings back from the USA on our Independence holiday week...

Chevan
07-02-2012, 12:52 AM
Russia wants a US/NATO war against Syria, for the spike in arms sales that the Syrians are using to massacre their civilian population...
To sell the weapon to Syria Russia doesn't need the war there.And BTW, Nick, if CIA sponsors and arms the so called "opposition" they keep responsibility for bloody bath there as well alongside the Asad.

Chevan
07-05-2012, 01:36 AM
The external allien forces continie to pump up the violence in Syria..
10,000 armed men enter Syria for civil war (http://www.presstv.com/detail/2012/07/02/249021/10k-armed-men-enter-syria-for-civil-war/)

An estimated 10,000 armed men equipped with highly-sophisticated weapons, including anti-tank missiles, have reportedly entered Syria to help fuel the unrest in the country, Press TV has learned.
Informed sources in the Qusayr village in Homs say the terrorists crossed into Syria from the Lebanese border and that they have taken positions in the suburbs of the restive city.
Syrian forces also managed to retake control of Damascus suburb of Douma, forcing the armed men to flee the region. The Arab country’s authorities say the armed groups are using ''scorched earth policy'' and they destroy the area they held before retreating.
Syria has been experiencing a deadly unrest since mid-March 2011. The violence has claimed the lives of many people, including large numbers of security forces.
While the West and the Syrian opposition say the government is responsible for the killings, Damascus blames ''outlaws, saboteurs and armed terrorist gangs'' for the unrest, insisting that it is being orchestrated from abroad.

no doubts the CIA has changed tactic. After the fiasco of imposed "inner revolution" now they begin a direct military intervention. Although the american media persistently calls the anti-gevement forces as "people's opposition" - they look rather like heavy armed foreign mercenary army mow.

Nickdfresh
07-05-2012, 05:23 PM
To sell the weapon to Syria Russia doesn't need the war there.And BTW, Nick, if CIA sponsors and arms the so called "opposition" they keep responsibility for bloody bath there as well alongside the Asad.

Technically, the CIA isn't handing out arms, they're acting as a gatekeeper...


The external allien forces continie to pump up the violence in Syria..
10,000 armed men enter Syria for civil war (http://www.presstv.com/detail/2012/07/02/249021/10k-armed-men-enter-syria-for-civil-war/)

no doubts the CIA has changed tactic. After the fiasco of imposed "inner revolution" now they begin a direct military intervention. Although the american media persistently calls the anti-gevement forces as "people's opposition" - they look rather like heavy armed foreign mercenary army mow.

Ten thousand sounds like a very inflated number as I'm pretty sure that that is the estimate of the entire Free Syrian Army membership...

*correction, the Free Syrian Army is around 70,000 strong...

Nickdfresh
07-05-2012, 05:27 PM
5 July 2012 Last updated at 08:11 ET

Syria files: Wikileaks releases 2m 'embarrassing' emails

The whistle-blowing website Wikileaks says it is releasing more than two million emails from Syrian political figures, ministries and corporations.

"Ground-breaking" news stories derived from the "Syria files" will be published over the next two months, Wikileaks said.

Its founder Julian Assange was quoted as saying the material was embarrassing - not only to Syria but its opponents.

The emails are said to date from August 2006 to March 2012.

Syrian authorities have been fighting an internal rebellion for some 16 months. Some 15,800 people have died, activists say.
Intimate correspondence'

Emails from the Syrian ministries of presidential affairs, foreign affairs, finance, information, transport and culture are all represented among the data to be released, Sarah Harrison from Wikileaks told reporters in London.

"The range of information extends from the intimate correspondence of the most senior [governing] Baath party figures to records of financial transfers sent from Syrian ministries to other nations," she said.

Mr Assange remains in the Ecuadorean embassy in London, where he is trying to avoid extradition to Sweden over accusations of rape and sexual assault.

But Ms Harrison quoted him as saying that this material "helps us not merely to criticise one group or another, but to understand their interests, actions and thoughts. It is only through understanding this conflict that we can hope to resolve it."

Some of the 2,434,899 emails would reveal, Wikileaks promises, "how the West and Western companies say one thing and do another".

News stories based on the emails will be published by news providers including US news agency Associated Press, Spain's Publico.es and Egypt's al-Masry al-Youm.

Some stories which have already appeared seem to concern communications between Syrian representatives and Western suppliers of equipment that could be used for military purposes.

BBCnews (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-18724328)


Direct link: http://wikileaks.org/syria-files/

Chevan
07-06-2012, 12:27 AM
Technically, the CIA isn't handing out arms, they're acting as a gatekeeper...
Yes, the ordinary tactic of special services is to be in shade. No doubts however the CIA realize the general management and command all of rebels's forces.


Ten thousand sounds like a very inflated number as I'm pretty sure that that is the estimate of the entire Free Syrian Army membership...

*correction, the Free Syrian Army is around 70,000 strong...

10 thousands is the only last reinforcement ,they claim. Nobody know for sure how many of those 70 thousands are really belong to syrian opposition and how many area just foreign commandos who kills for money.

Chevan
07-06-2012, 01:15 AM
Its founder Julian Assange was quoted as saying the material was embarrassing - not only to Syria but its opponents.
Some of the 2,434,899 emails would reveal, Wikileaks promises, "how the West and Western companies say one thing and do another".

Its very interesting why BBC quoted such a highly controversal source like Wikileaks , known for scandal material against american and eurpean authorities.


But Ms Harrison quoted him as saying that this material "helps us not merely to criticise one group or another, but to understand their interests, actions and thoughts. It is only through understanding this conflict that we can hope to resolve it."
No wonder the both sides of conflict Assad and his opponents ( and who stand behind them) apply the simular genocidal methods of fight, accusing each other.

DVX
07-16-2012, 07:57 PM
No wonder the both sides of conflict Assad and his opponents ( and who stand behind them) apply the simular genocidal methods of fight, accusing each other.

Unfortunatly the civil wars are, as a matter of fact, even dirtier than the wars against a foreigner enemy.
In my opinion, Syria is a step for the USA towards Iran and an attempt to push back an historical Russian influence on the area.
You surely remeber that the Georgian crazy dictator caused the war with Russia after being supported and feeded up by CIA and Israel. And the Goergia is an important strategical point for oil pipelines inside a bigger strategic oil-producing area.
Syria, even if not an oil producer, is a door in that area, geographic and it could become also political, if Assad falls down. After, the way for Iran is open. And in the meantime, Russia would be forced to a step back in its influence area.
Iran is the only oil big producer still free from USA control and from a public debt owned abroad (not a secundary aspect), that means from the plutocratic world rulers...
I'm scared about the possibility that the well known US attitude to feed up every "son of a bitch, but our son of a bitch" - in the unforgetable summary of Henry Kissinger - could cause an escalation of the Islamic extremism in a country substancially laic and where in the past the islamic fundamentalists were swept away by Assad senior.

Neutral
09-12-2012, 08:42 AM
In memory of Issa, Ahmed and Sheihk, they died for their children's future.

http://www.globalpost.com/photo-galleries/planet-pic/5718451/life-and-death-aleppo-photos

Watch also the video 'Surviving Aleppo'.


Neutral

JR*
09-14-2012, 08:31 AM
Good God ! Good God ... Thanks, Neutral, for the link - though following it was not exactly a pleasure. It is a salutory illustration of a certain reality for those of us who have had the good fortune not to have fought in a war. Good God.

I have a feeling that the Free Syrian forces have a certain strategy, based on the fact that the Syrian Army is designed and equipped to fight battles with Israel or Iraq, and not particularly well adapted, for example, to urban guerilla warfare. Tanks, 'copter gunships and fighter-bombers are very good in open country; less effective, however, in confined urban theatres like Aleppo. This lesson - which has been reiterated over and over since, well, the latter stages of the Battle of Cambrai - remains to a large extent valid, and may explain why the Opposition in Aleppo still survives. I would be interested in accurate figures for Assad's losses of armoured vehicles. Assad himself was trained as a tank commander; I am sure he is well aware of the problem.

The difficulty for the Opposition is that if your enemy cares little about how much civilian infrastructure he demolishes with his heavy weapons, or about how many of his own people he kills, attempts to exploit tactical distinctions of this sort may prove unproductive - and very, very many people may die as a result. A terrible, terrible situation.

Yours in sadness,

JR.

Neutral
09-14-2012, 09:53 AM
@JR

When I first posted this link there was no video, only the photos. Couldn't agree more with you when you say that 'following it was not exactly a pleasure'. They even killed the stray cats, for @#$@#$ sake, just to make the other side suffer... It is hard to have faith in mankind when one has to cope with the reality of it...

Yours in sadness indeed,

Neutral

Chevan
09-16-2012, 01:17 PM
In memory of Issa, Ahmed and Sheihk, they died for their children's future.


Is this that future (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEqXwH7gDn8&bpctr=1347817459) they dreamed for their children?

Chevan
09-16-2012, 01:38 PM
The difficulty for the Opposition is that if your enemy cares little about how much civilian infrastructure he demolishes with his heavy weapons, or about how many of his own people he kills.

The main proble of opposition, as it turned to be, is that it consist mostly from... foreigners who fought for money ( sponsored by foreign countries) and care less whom to kill .The soldiers of Asad army are the syrians who lived among the local people. The foreigners( including the muslim fanatics) are the terrosits who targeted everything. No wonder they have to use the Al-quada tactic in Alepo- attacking the Army from ambush. The exactly the way the Talibam fought the Americans in Afganistan - very costly for locals.And. btw , the coalition also pretty well used the heavy armor there - may be they care about the people?;)

Neutral
09-16-2012, 04:11 PM
@Chevan

I started this thread to share a news piece that touched my heart, at no instance did I refer to the Syrian conflict in itself. I do not agree with your comments at all.

In my opinion your second post has so much wrong and/or biased info that I wouldn't know were to start. I will say this though: Ambush tactics are around probably since the first army was formed, they are hardly an Al-Qaeda invention (?).

In memory of Issa, Ahmed and Sheihk, I like to believe that they died for their children's future.

Chevan
09-17-2012, 02:41 AM
Well, i believ the each side of that bloody conflict is sure they fight for their childrens future - like during the any war in history including the ww2. And yes, i do agree the TERRORISM ( nemely islamic sort of it) hasn't been invented by Al-queda. I just find it very odd that the westerners seeing the scene of killing pows or civils by muslim crowd , crying "allah acbar" still believ this crowd is "democratic opposition to regime". As it occured to be in Libya - this crowd has an slightly different view on democratic principles, from Western ones.

Nickdfresh
09-17-2012, 09:05 AM
Well, i believ the each side of that bloody conflict is sure they fight for their childrens future - like during the any war in history including the ww2. And yes, i do agree the TERRORISM ( nemely islamic sort of it) hasn't been invented by Al-queda. I just find it very odd that the westerners seeing the scene of killing pows or civils by muslim crowd , crying "allah acbar" still believ this crowd is "democratic opposition to regime". As it occured to be in Libya - this crowd has an slightly different view on democratic principles, from Western ones.

Chevan, you keep repeating this silly claims that have long been debunked by the international community. While the Free Syrian Army rebels certainly are not innocent, no one takes seriously claims (originating from the Syrian gov't) that they are behind the majority of carnage. It is Syrian gov't forces using artillery, air power, and ill-disciplined Alawite militias against the ethnic minorities...

Chevan
09-17-2012, 12:36 PM
Chevan, you keep repeating this silly claims that have long been debunked by the international community. While the Free Syrian Army rebels certainly are not innocent, no one takes seriously claims (originating from the Syrian gov't) that they are behind the majority of carnage.

Me repeat?!!Noway!!!Did you ever watch at what your american and western fellows writes in oppositional sites?
Take a short look here (http://www.canberratimes.com.au/opinion/alqaeda-now-a-us-ally-in-syria-20120910-25oby.html)
"While we reflect on the 11th anniversary of the al Qaeda attacks on American soil, there is a blinding light that may obscure our view: this sworn enemy now fights hand in hand with the US against the Syrian regime.
The historic State of the Union address by US president George W. Bush on September 20, 2001 is loaded with morals and principles about good and evil.
The president's ultimatum was clear: either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists.
In Syria, there is mounting evidence that Al Qaeda and its allies are actively deploying terror tactics and suicide bombers to overthrow the Assad regime.
"Is it not interesting?
But i especialy like the comments under this article
http://news.antiwar.com/2012/09/09/clinton-bashes-russias-syria-peace-plan/
"
CanuckBC · 1 week ago
US officials are lying again. In Geneva Plan all sides agreed there is a need for reconciliation in Syria and building a government of unity. Russians and Chinese insisted that only Syrian people can decide. Americans knowing that most of "opposition" are foreign fighters are afraid of letting Syrians to decide, since most of opposition would have no voice in general elections. Clinton clearly does not believe that Syrians can decide as Clinton and probably Israel want .
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persnipoles80p · 1 week ago
When 'the US' imposes ‘consequences for non-compliance’ for a country on it's hit list, it will spread fantasies of that country's 'non-compliance' so as to impose those 'consequences' and more. A sovereign government might as well ignore US imposed rules, the results will be the same. They're generating foreign rebellions now, and it's disgusting that they're still pretending to be in a 'dialogue' with anyone.
__________________________________________
davidgrayling103p · 1 week ago
American dialogue consists of the following: er, ah, mmmmmm, cough, gesture with thumb, sighing, shouting, hissing, spitting, gesture with one finger, smashing the table, kicking wildly, snoring, ****ing, glaring, staring, and teeth-grinding. Verbal communication is not allowed!

Clinton excels at these activities and can even get her eyes to look demented either singly or in unison!
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Yonatan · 1 week ago
Shorter Clinton: we don't want no stinkin' peace.
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Mark Thomason · 1 week ago
This proposal would condemn what the US and friends are doing equally with Assad.

The US would condemn Assad for resisting what it is doing.

That is the real confrontation.

Hillary's seeks to use this to shoehorn in a UN authorization for US force, which is the exact opposite of Russia's intent in offering it.

Those are the two reasons why it will go nowhere.
__________________________________________________ ___
peter vojta · 1 week ago
Oh Hillary, trying so hard!!!
Hitlary wants war so badly. As a "woman and mother", she is desparate to see some childern dying again...peter czech
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★FALCON★124p · 1 week ago
Russia's plan is to continue the Assad regime while the Obama / Clinton plan is to install the Al-Qaida Muslim Brotherhood and terrorize the entire region with a consolidated Sharia Super-State.

I see a lose / lose for everyone involved.
"
For further educational puposes , check this site out- there are a tonns of such articles.
How it fascinating to read what real anti-war american opposition ( i guess leftish) think!Can you say all those people are silly?
So tell me please which exactly and when the "claims have been debunked by international community" if even american inner comunity has no illusions about it. Still suggest it ordinating from Syrian gov?Who is silly now?


It is Syrian gov't forces using artillery, air power, and ill-disciplined Alawite militias against the ethnic minorities...
Sure they use heavy weapon- the Syria had an regular Army though. What they have to use- the spears and knifes?Just in case you are not informed enough the US army and coalition in Iraq and Afganistan CONSTANTLY uses the tanks , aircrafts and even remoto-controlled bombers-drons against rebels( sometimes very "succesfully" , hitting the dozen of civils and milicia per one shot:)). Wish to complain about it to Hague court?

Nickdfresh
09-17-2012, 01:02 PM
What do I care what uniformed, extremist right wing dipshits think? Many of those posters were the same ones that believe that creating a "democratic Middle Eastern oasis" in Iraq would transform the Middle East into a reformist paradise. Now apparently they believe that bloodstained, lawless regimes murdering their own people with their army is preferable to an "Arab Spring". Saying al Qaida is fighting against the Syrian regime is sort of like saying that Nazis are fighting for freedom of speech. Occasionally they do when it is in their interest. So what? In any case, it's only a relative small number of foreign fighters and ***** bastard regimes like the Assad and ex-Mubarak ones that gave rise to al Qaida more than any other single factor. Most of the former brain trust of whatever constituted al Qaida came out of the torture hellholes that were Egyptian prisons from the 1950's to 90's...

Chevan
09-18-2012, 12:41 AM
So your american opposition are "utter extremist", "right-wing nazis" and just "full idiots"?!!! How is genious!I think you should add the "enemy of american people" and "Assad's spyes"- that would be perfect at all! Common Nick, you do not live in USSR.;)


In any case, it's only a relative small number of foreign fighters
Relatively small number?How to say!!
http://www.defencemanagement.com/feature_story.asp?id=20632


'Foreign Jihadists are flocking to Syria'
07 September 2012

Anthony Tucker-Jones reports on how Syrian rebels are increasingly accepting the support of al-Qaida affiliated radical Islamist groups

There is growing concern that the rebel Free Syrian Army (FSA) is increasingly relying on foreign al-Qaida affiliated jihadists. This is in part driven by the failure of the international community to act after 18 months of conflict.

In February, Osama bin Laden's heir as leader of al-Qaida, Ayman al-Zawahiri, issued a call to arms for militants to support their brothers in Syria.

Ever since an Islamist group claimed responsibility for a major bomb attack in Damascus in mid-July it has become apparent that the FSA's guerrilla war is increasingly adopting the urban terror tactics of the jihadist movement.

Birmingham MP Khalid Mahmood has warned that British Muslims are travelling to Syria to wage jihad. A Londoner was discovered fighting with the rebels in Aleppo, while opposition fighters including men with British Midlands and South London accents recently took journalist John Cantlie hostage – albeit briefly. This has led to calls that those visiting war zones should have their passports revoked.

Ed Husain, author of The Islamist, has shown how easy it is for disenchanted young British Muslims to be recruited by radical groups such as Jamat-e-Islami and Hizb ut-Tahrir. Foreign fighters are also said to come from Croatia, Kosovo, Lebanon, Libya, Morocco, Saudi Arabia, Tunisia and Turkey.

Sunni Muslims see it as their duty to support their co-religionists in the struggle against President Bashar al-Assad's Shia-based Alawite regime. It is also important to remember that al-Qaida is a Sunni organisation.

General Abdel-Aziz who defected to the FSA has warned: "The longer it takes [to oust Assad], the more groups and agendas get involved, and the more people from outside complicate our battles."

While Syria has its own local jihadist groups such as the Ahrar al-Sham fighting in Aleppo, the conflict has drawn in the Lebanon-based Palestinian Fatah al-Islam and the Palestinian Abdullah Azzam Brigades. Abdullah Azzam was Osama bin Laden's mentor during the 1980s. The Islamist Front for the Protection of the Syrian People or Jabhat al-Nusra li-Ahl al-Sham is believed to be supported by elements of al-Qaida in-Iraq.

Jihadists flocking to foreign wars is nothing new, they did this in Afghanistan, Bosnia and Chechnya - where they were considered more of a liability than an asset. Most tend to be little more than inexperienced war tourists and danger seekers, but while their impact on the fighting is always marginal, it's the impact they have on the peace that is the real cause for concern.

FSA leaders have little choice but to accept the help of Islamist fighters and worry about the consequences later. The FSA claims to have around 40,000 men under arms fighting Syrian government forces numbering up to 200,000.

In the meantime the breakdown of civil law in the face of the fighting in Syria has led to the rise of religious law. In liberated areas in the cities of Aleppo, Dier al-Zour and Homs the rebels have been instigating Islamic courts, operating under Sharia law and issuing summary justice.

While the numbers of foreigners fighting in Syria are currently low, as the war drags more foreign jihadists will flock to the country. They will be harbouring a sense of grievance that the West stood by while innocent people were killed on Assad's orders. In the past this perception led to the rise of militant Islam and bloody attacks on the west.

The legacy of al-Qaida has already been brought home to the streets of New York, Madrid and London. The worry is that British Jihadists could return from Syria to wreak mindless havoc on the streets of Britain's cities.
Why such an real political analysis isn't presented in CNN?
What do you say? The "etremists" are everywhere around again?

Nickdfresh
09-18-2012, 12:04 PM
So your american opposition are "utter extremist", "right-wing nazis" and just "full idiots"?!!! How is genious!I think you should add the "enemy of american people" and "Assad's spyes"- that would be perfect at all! Common Nick, you do not live in USSR.;)


Yes, many of them are, and they're painfully short sighted...


Relatively small number?How to say!!
http://www.defencemanagement.com/feature_story.asp?id=20632

Why such an real political analysis isn't presented in CNN?
What do you say? The "etremists" are everywhere around again?

What were the percentages of "foreign fighters" again?

Chevan
09-19-2012, 03:30 AM
Yes, many of them are, and they're painfully short sighted...

Agree, but not all the american presidents behaved reasonable as well- remember George W Bush?The some reasons the America send a troops for a war looked even more stupid!So just pure of political correctness and folowing the rights of freedom of speech - i can't say all the american anti-war opposition are morons.Some of them tell very true thoughts.


What were the percentages of "foreign fighters" again?
Nobody known the correct figures for sure. Well i guess the CIA has an more or less true statistic but hides it coz they would dismiss the agenda "the FSA as a Syrian opposition". Thosugh the internet has an few pieces of infor that might to clarify the situation.
We recently has already descussed the article where was told about 10 000 of foreign fighters crossed the Syrian border from Turkey and joining to FSA. Many of then are the former fighters of "Libyan opposition" who nade a bloody mess in Lybia last year.Here is an article about such butchers
http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2012/08/09/the_syrian_rebels_libyan_weapon


The Tripoli Brigade was one of the first rebel units into the Libyan capital in August 2011. Its fighters, who included many Libyan expatriates, had received training from Qatari special forces in Nalut, a town in Libya's western mountains. After the fall of Tripoli, during which he participated in the battle for Muammar al-Qaddafi's Bab al-Aziziya compound, Harati was appointed deputy head of the Tripoli Military Council (TMC), serving under Abdel Hakim Belhaj, former leader of the now-defunct Libyan Islamic Fighting Group. Last autumn Harati stepped down as commander of the brigade and as TMC deputy. He made his first trip to Syria shortly afterward for what he says was initially humanitarian work in the country's northern borderlands. The idea for Liwa al-Ummah came this year.

"There was a sense of increasing frustration among the Syrian thuwar [revolutionaries] over their lack of coordination," he says. "They asked me if I could help them train and organize, and I agreed."

According to Harati, more than 6,000 men across Syria have joined Liwa al-Ummah since its establishment three months ago. Most are members of existing rebel battalions or groups who decided to come under the Liwa al-Ummah umbrella; others signed up as individuals.
6000 come from ONLY Libya. But how many of terrorists come from Turkey and Saudi else?
So as we see even the FSA agreed the essential part of their "warriors" are "foreigns jihadists". Who are Jihadist i guess you know!! And how "Sharia law" corresponds to Democrasy as well!!
Here is a "video reports" (http://www.facebook.com/Lewa.Alamah)of their bloody activity accompanied with all those "Allah Acbar",disgusting "Wahhabi songs" and other matter so loved by Hezbolla and Taliban.
I want to hotice- independently of percentage they have in FSA, the jihadist is the most active and fierce part of FSA whose tutures and murders of pows and "suspected in pro-assad sympaties civils" just flooding the youtube. The "CNN and Co" makes a pose like nothing happend, continie the foolish propogand about "democratic rebels' while it getting more and more obvious for the americans - there is unfair anti-american game. Coz destabilizing the middle east the americnas ( and isaelis) creat the conditions to come to power such an radical islamic forces- compared to which the regimes of Assad and Ahmadinejad will look like a super Democracy. Like it happend in Libya where the former "democratic rebels/fighters with regime of Gadaffi"( how else they called that gang?) killed the american ambassador. Why do you think , during Gadaffi nobody attack the americans in Libya? This is another theme the American brainwashsed-media try not to rise up.

Chevan
09-19-2012, 04:14 AM
One more interesting article from "Modern Tokyo Times" about close ties of Taliban and FSA.
http://global-security-news.com/2012/09/05/afghanistan-and-syria-even-funeral-processions-are-attacked-by-fsa-and-the-taliban/


The Taliban and Free Syrian Army (FSA) have much in common when it comes to car bombs, attacking funeral processions and beheading people. In recent times the brutal nature of the Taliban and FSA can be seen by scores of people being killed during funeral processions by both terrorist forces. Neither the Taliban nor the FSA respect the living or the dead instead they both spread their hatred to every fabric of society which is deemed permissible to attack.
Organizations and wealthy individuals in Saudi Arabia and Qatar who sponsor terrorism will share much in common with both the FSA and the Taliban. After all, these terrorist organizations are deemed to be “the soldiers of Sunni Islamic jihad” within the stark militancy of the countries where funding is easily obtained.
Of course, with the vast majority of individuals who did September 11 coming from Saudi Arabia alongside the largest forces of international Islamists fighting in Iraq coming from the same country; then the Saudi connection to international terrorism is more than obvious. At the same time both Saudi Arabia and Qatar are spreading the dangerous Salafi ideology whereby other Muslims are deemed to be infidels like non-Muslims. This means that other Muslims and non-Muslims are deemed to be subhuman and worthy of slaughter providing Islamist clerics sanction this murder.
The mass contradiction of spreading hatred to Afghanistan, Pakistan, Syria, Mali, Somalia and a host of other nations, doesn’t apply to the policies of individuals and organizations which fund Salafi indoctrination and terrorism. On the contrary, the mass contradiction applies to nations like America, France and the United Kingdom which deem the same terrorist forces to be either friends or foes depending on the given situation.
Therefore, while the nation of Syria is on the frontline of protecting secularism, the rights of women and protecting all religious minorities against the forces of terrorism and Islamist ideology. The hypocrites in Washington, London and Paris are on the same side of the brutal forces of Islamist terrorism, car bombing, sectarianism and other evil deeds against the government of Syria. Yet in Afghanistan, the very same nations which supported Islamist terrorism in the 1980s and early 1990s are now fighting the same forces they once supported. It is this schizophrenic policy which is most alarming because these Western powers clearly have no morals.
Given this reality, it is now open season against the government of Syria. This means that car bombings, killing minorities, attacking funeral processions, killing journalists and other brutal deeds by the FSA and Islamist factions like al-Qaeda; are all glossed over and manipulated by language and a compliant media which is also inciting hatred. However, for the people of Afghanistan, Pakistan and Syria (and other nations) it is clear that all terrorist attacks are evil and should be condemned. Not only this, all ratlines which are maintaining the flow of funding brutal terrorist organizations like the FSA, al-Qaeda and the Taliban should be eradicated where it is possible. However, when it comes to Syria it is clear that nations like America, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Turkey, the United Kingdom and France are enabling these Islamist and terrorist ratlines to spread their sectarian hatred to the people of Syria.
Seems more and more people around the wolld warn that FSA slowly but hard is turning to an "Al-queda department".The author looks biased and anti-western, i guess , however the everyone may will have convinced in youtube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUopTzuQxBc&feature=youtu.be) that the behaviour of FSA islamist is very alike to the Taliban and Al-queda in Iraq/afganistan endeed.

Nickdfresh
09-19-2012, 04:01 PM
Agree, but not all the american presidents behaved reasonable as well- remember George W Bush?The some reasons the America send a troops for a war looked even more stupid!So just pure of political correctness and folowing the rights of freedom of speech - i can't say all the american anti-war opposition are morons.Some of them tell very true thoughts.

This is a completely different situation than Iraq was, and I highly doubt any US or NATO troops will directly become involved at this point...


Nobody known the correct figures for sure. Well i guess the CIA has an more or less true statistic but hides it coz they would dismiss the agenda "the FSA as a Syrian opposition". Thosugh the internet has an few pieces of infor that might to clarify the situation.
We recently has already descussed the article where was told about 10 000 of foreign fighters crossed the Syrian border from Turkey and joining to FSA. Many of then are the former fighters of "Libyan opposition" who nade a bloody mess in Lybia last year.Here is an article about such butchers
http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2012/08/09/the_syrian_rebels_libyan_weapon

6000 come from ONLY Libya. But how many of terrorists come from Turkey and Saudi else?
So as we see even the FSA agreed the essential part of their "warriors" are "foreigns jihadists". Who are Jihadist i guess you know!! And how "Sharia law" corresponds to Democrasy as well!!
Here is a "video reports" (http://www.facebook.com/Lewa.Alamah)of their bloody activity accompanied with all those "Allah Acbar",disgusting "Wahhabi songs" and other matter so loved by Hezbolla and Taliban.
I want to hotice- independently of percentage they have in FSA, the jihadist is the most active and fierce part of FSA whose tutures and murders of pows and "suspected in pro-assad sympaties civils" just flooding the youtube. The "CNN and Co" makes a pose like nothing happend, continie the foolish propogand about "democratic rebels' while it getting more and more obvious for the americans - there is unfair anti-american game. Coz destabilizing the middle east the americnas ( and isaelis) creat the conditions to come to power such an radical islamic forces- compared to which the regimes of Assad and Ahmadinejad will look like a super Democracy. Like it happend in Libya where the former "democratic rebels/fighters with regime of Gadaffi"( how else they called that gang?) killed the american ambassador. Why do you think , during Gadaffi nobody attack the americans in Libya? This is another theme the American brainwashsed-media try not to rise up.


Nobody knows the exact makeup of the FSA rebels, not even themselves as there is no monolithic command structure and there are many divisions within the rebels and they have difficulty coordinating things. There is no "propaganda" about all the rebels being "democratic," so I have no idea what you mean. It's simply the truth that Assad began a harsh crackdown that included massacres and the use of military firepower on their own civil centers. Assad decided he was going to use the same harsh tactics his father used in the late 1970's and 80's against the Sunni population of artillery and air power, this time it backfired.

Saudi Arabia and Turkey are involved since Turkey is on the border and has to process all the refugees and the Saudis are in a long running rivalry with the Iranians who are decidedly backing Assad to the point they have entire units involved in the fighting now and are organizing and planning much of this.


As far as foriegn membership in the FSA, I doubt they have much idea and numbers are merely speculation. From Wiki: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Syrian_Army#Foreign_combatants)


Foreign combatants

The number of foreign Sunni militants active within the FSA is hard to assess. In late May 2012, based on interviews with FSA fighters, it was reported that 300 Lebanese had joined the FSA. The presence of Algerians, Tunisians, Jordanians and fighters from Saudi Arabia was also confirmed.[268][269] A leader of the FSA told an AFP correspondent that five Libyan combatants have been killed in clashes with the Syrian Army. The same leader, while denying the presence of many foreign fighters, said that there are few of different nationalities. Peter Harling, from the International Crisis Group, told the AFP that the proportion of foreign fighters is currently very small, but might grow after Saudi Arabia and Qatar announced their support for arming the rebels.[270]

Croatian General Marinko Krešić confrimed that there are between 80 and 100 Croat mercenaries between the ages of 40 and 60 helping the Free Syrian Army. They are veterans from the Croatian War of Independence (1991-95) or Bosnian War (1992-95), but also fought as mercenaries in Iraqi War (2003-11), Libyan civil war, Tunisian revolution and Egyptian revolution. Krešić stated that some are serving as security, instructors while others are killing. He also stated that they are very well trained and that "they are the one who will probably kill rather then be killed". Krešić stated that their payment is up to 2,000 US$ a day due to "rich foreign donators". He also added that the majority of the volunteers coming from the Balkans to help the FSA are Serbs and citizens of Bosnia and Herzegovina.[271][272][273] Sources close to the Belgrade military circles confrimed that the former members of the Kosovo Liberation Army are also aiding the FSA. They are mostly instructors who train the rebels mostly for the urban and the guerrilla warfare.[274]

There are dozens of Kuwait's volunteers entering from Turkey that are fighting in ranks of the FSA. The volunteers are given Syrian IDs as a precautionary measure in case they are arrested, before they are armed and sent to fight in different locations across the troubled country.[275]

Nickdfresh
09-19-2012, 04:02 PM
Moving this over to the military section and combing with previous Syria thread...

Chevan
09-25-2012, 01:49 PM
. There is no "propaganda" about all the rebels being "democratic," so I have no idea what you mean.

Oh common!! What a suspicious lack of awareness
Sometimes you have to watch that damned ZNN:)

http://www.sacouncil.com/index.php/news/press-releases/coalition-for-a-democratic-syria-asks-obama-romney-to-support-no-fly-zones-additional-arms-for-free-syrian-army/
Coalition for a Democratic Syria Asks Obama, Romney to Support No-Fly Zones, Additional Arms for Free Syrian Army

Obviously the "democratic mojahedens" in FSA goes out of ammo and can't continie their "democratic jihad" .May be they should ask the weapon for their "muslim-brothers" in Afganistan too?Why not ,if Obama and Romney so kind today!!


It's simply the truth that Assad began a harsh crackdown that included massacres and the use of military firepower on their own civil centers. Assad decided he was going to use the same harsh tactics his father used in the late 1970's and 80's against the Sunni population of artillery and air power, this time it backfired.

I just checked out the american media
Yeah they tells about the same..
http://abcnews.go.com/International/obama-calls-syrias-assad-step-freezes-assets/story?id=14330428#.UGHoM7LN_Sg
but i specially love the comments down the page.
You know - it's very useful to watch the comments just to make sure how the local people take it

karek40

We have radical islam in Libya, seriously heading that way in Egypt and our president wants Assad to step down. Looks like we would learn if Assad steps down radical islam will control Syria. Almost appears that is the plan.
________________________________
singDavidsong

the U.N.'s High Commissioner for Human Rights Navi Pillay should suggest that the Security Council refer Bush and Cheney to the International Criminal Court for their role in the violence in Iraq and torture of its citizens at Abu Garib.
_____________________________
Gringo817

Amazing how, out of all these weird looking clown-like Mid East tyrants on their way out, Assad is the only one that appears in pictures, to look almost normal. Clean shaven, nice haircut, and all. Appearances can be deceiving !!!!


Is it not AMAZING!!;)
Seems most of americans DON"T even trust their media!! And i believe them coz i don't see the reasosnt to believe to our Putin's managed medias too.


As far as foriegn membership in the FSA, I doubt they have much idea and numbers are merely speculation. From Wiki: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Syrian_Army#Foreign_combatants)
And who does write WIKI?!!
The figures in wiki contrudict even to the words of fsa leaders!!plust the article dated by may - now the situation has changed much. The foreign terrorists-juhadists flooding the FSA since those days- this is the fact the western mass media agreed.

Nickdfresh
09-26-2012, 07:38 AM
Oh common!! What a suspicious lack of awareness
Sometimes you have to watch that damned ZNN:)

You mean CNN and I get info from a variety of sources, including PBS Frontline. But interestingly, a CNN reporter was with the gov't Army troops yesterday reporting from "their side" in Aleppo...


Obviously the "democratic mojahedens" in FSA goes out of ammo and can't continie their "democratic jihad" .May be they should ask the weapon for their "muslim-brothers" in Afganistan too?Why not ,if Obama and Romney so kind today!!

You're engaging in a strawman argument, I never said they were "democratic"...


I just checked out the american media
Yeah they tells about the same..
http://abcnews.go.com/International/obama-calls-syrias-assad-step-freezes-assets/story?id=14330428#.UGHoM7LN_Sg
but i specially love the comments down the page.
You know - it's very useful to watch the comments just to make sure how the local people take it

Is it not AMAZING!!;)
Seems most of americans DON"T even trust their media!! And i believe them coz i don't see the reasosnt to believe to our Putin's managed medias too.

I don't really care about comments left as they are indicative of nothing. The truth is that most Americans are apathetic about Syria just like most Russians support the Assad regime because they grant naval and military facility access.


And who does write WIKI?!!
The figures in wiki contrudict even to the words of fsa leaders!!plust the article dated by may - now the situation has changed much. The foreign terrorists-juhadists flooding the FSA since those days- this is the fact the western mass media agreed.

A variety of people are allowed to write on articles for Wiki. Who wrote the sources you've cited? Do you even know what event triggered the rebellion against the Assad regime more than any other?

Chevan
10-02-2012, 01:57 PM
You mean CNN and I get info from a variety of sources, including PBS Frontline. But interestingly, a CNN reporter was with the gov't Army troops yesterday reporting from "their side" in Aleppo...

Really? What did they report? The "anothe one brutal mass murder of civils by assad's army" Common:)



You're engaging in a strawman argument, I never said they were "democratic"...

Did i ever write you said it?? You , seems doubt about propogand which portray the rebels beeing the democratic!!No?


I don't really care about comments left as they are indicative of nothing. The truth is that most Americans are apathetic about Syria just like most Russians support the Assad regime because they grant naval and military facility access.

The comments of peoples tell endeed a much of!! The americans apathetic about Syria just compared with the hysteria the american mass media - they obvioulsy spread sometimes a nonsense which adult resonable american can't even take.I don't really care neiter about russian "imperial" ambitions nor even about profit selling to regime of assad the weapon. We just see that the those gang of ugly islamic killers who is called "opposition" by mass media endeed bring the evil much worst then the regime of assad itself.


A variety of people are allowed to write on articles for Wiki.

Really? So how about to write an article in english wiki, say from Nort Korean point of view?Wish to try?The cencorship in wiki just repeat the mainstream propogand-line in mass media- you are too old not beeing aware of such a things.


Who wrote the sources you've cited? Do you even know what event triggered the rebellion against the Assad regime more than any other?
The sources i citied are the WESTERN sources that you can verify.But as it occures to be - the comment of people are more informative that the article in matter of studying of social oppinion.Like that..


Sad to inform you but we would still be losing 750,000 jobs a month, only essential workers are left. And that job growth you say for 17 months, were they also in unknown zip codes again? Is Obama's illegal war funded? Was the failed trillion buck stimulus funded? How about Obama care we wasted 18 months on that is useless why the economy was getting worse? If we have had such job growth for 17 months you would think everybody would have a job. Instead we have more people getting layed off, business closing.[b]You can listen to whatever this bunch tells you, spin it around and there is the truth[b]. Matter of fact Obama said yesterday this country would be stronger than ever after the recession ends.I thought he said last year the recession has already ended. Yet another false tale. But follow him off the cliff.Given another 4 yrs we are done
Did you know the US losing the 750 000 of a jobs per month?While those warmongers (http://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/Images/2012/9/24/20129248147985734_20.jpg)
rise up a anti-iranian hysteria , claiming the USA has NO MORE serious troble then to protect a "civilized man" the average americans lose their jobs!!

Nickdfresh
10-03-2012, 12:16 PM
Really? What did they report? The "anothe one brutal mass murder of civils by assad's army" Common:)

I'm glad you can smile about that, but yes. Of course these are radicals like UN observers and various journalists from the international community. So I guess Assad never massacres his people and commits atrocities by using heavy artillery and air power specifically ethnic neighborhoods such as Sunnis?

I think more specifically, what triggered the events of today was when a group of (Sunni?) youths wrote anti-Assad slogans on the walls of buildings during the 'Arab Spring' protests. At that time, the protests within Syria were peaceful. But Assad's secret police took the kids into custody and their parents never saw them again except for of course the torture photos that were released. Their fathers were told to "forget about" these children and to "make other ones." And then told if they weren't man enough to do it themselves, to bring their wives in. Most of the kids died under torture and some were possibly used in pederasty rapes...

But I guess they just "made that up?" That despite the bloody history of the Assad dynasty going back to the 1970's where use of heavy artillery and live ammunition on defiant cities has been the norm...


Did i ever write you said it?? You , seems doubt about propogand which portray the rebels beeing the democratic!!No?

Some factions of the rebels are democratic Western-minded secularists, some are Islamist. That's inevitable. The Frontline program I viewed stated this and that there was tensions inside the FSA...


The comments of peoples tell endeed a much of!! The americans apathetic about Syria just compared with the hysteria the american mass media - they obvioulsy spread sometimes a nonsense which adult resonable american can't even take.I don't really care neiter about russian "imperial" ambitions nor even about profit selling to regime of assad the weapon. We just see that the those gang of ugly islamic killers who is called "opposition" by mass media endeed bring the evil much worst then the regime of assad itself.

Oh please, it's not the "mass media," it's from governmental bodies across the world including the UN...


Really? So how about to write an article in english wiki, say from Nort Korean point of view?Wish to try?The cencorship in wiki just repeat the mainstream propogand-line in mass media- you are too old not beeing aware of such a things.

Um, do you not recall that Wiki has numerous unfavorable entries regarding the war...Need I remind you that the same "hysterical mass media" in America actually broke the story of U.S. soldiers shooting at Korean civilians and conducting mass killings...


The sources i citied are the WESTERN sources that you can verify.But as it occures to be - the comment of people are more informative that the article in matter of studying of social oppinion.Like that..

I don't consider "Global Security" to be particularly reliable in their assessments often and they're written by some that have a partisan slant...


Did you know the US losing the 750 000 of a jobs per month?While those warmongers (http://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/Images/2012/9/24/20129248147985734_20.jpg)
rise up a anti-iranian hysteria , claiming the USA has NO MORE serious troble then to protect a "civilized man" the average americans lose their jobs!!

And? "Warmongers?" I think on the whole the U.S. gov't has been pretty reasonable and is hardly warmongering at this point. Did you not read of Israeli PM Netanyahu decrying now he's been snubbed lately?

Chevan
10-12-2012, 02:56 AM
I'm glad you can smile about that, but yes. Of course these are radicals like UN observers and various journalists from the international community. So I guess Assad never massacres his people and commits atrocities by using heavy artillery and air power specifically ethnic neighborhoods such as Sunnis?

DO you know a difference between the "people" and extremists?How do you qualify the people who explode the few officials , killing the dozen of civils?


I think more specifically, what triggered the events of today was when a group of (Sunni?) youths wrote anti-Assad slogans on the walls of buildings during the 'Arab Spring' protests. At that time, the protests within Syria were peaceful. But Assad's secret police took the kids into custody and their parents never saw them again except for of course the torture photos that were released.

By whom the photos been realized?Nicki?You like a kid ;)Look at the root..
If to folow such a logic if the Nizis has realized the photos of etnic germans brutally killed by poles near Danzig - shall we to think the Poland is guit in all atrocities of ww2? It should be carefully investigated who's killed those poor children in Syria- ether assad secret police or anothe terrorisic group.
And WHEN the Sunni islamic mojahedens ( who were alongside FSA since most first Siege of Daraa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April%E2%80%93May_2011_Daraa_siege))and Al-quada was a ..."peaceful"?This is absolutli new for me, can you inform please?


Their fathers were told to "forget about" these children and to "make other ones." And then told if they weren't man enough to do it themselves, to bring their wives in. Most of the kids died under torture and some were possibly used in pederasty rapes...

But I guess they just "made that up?" That despite the bloody history of the Assad dynasty going back to the 1970's where use of heavy artillery and live ammunition on defiant cities has been the norm...

If you a really very interested the history - you should know the Syria is not the only state which used the artillery against internal terrorist . All the other states in Middle East, including beloved Israel , used it CONSTANTLY and STILL ,killing the civils ( not only their own)?
Why ONLY Assad regime called "bloody" and needed to be overthrown ?Lets start from most first "candidates"..Say , why not to start from Libya immediatelly?Where bloody islamist killed an american ambassador?


ome factions of the rebels are democratic Western-minded secularists, some are Islamist. That's inevitable. The Frontline program I viewed stated this and that there was tensions inside the FSA.

Oh , that's fine- look like the democratic secularist might have a close friendship with Islamist from all of the world:)Seems the "democrats" in FSA care about fight for power more then for a DEMOCRACY.
Just wonder why those idiots in USA still spend a billions , figting the Islamist from Al-queda..Is it inevitable to fight them you you are arm them?



Um, do you not recall that Wiki has numerous unfavorable entries regarding the war...Need I remind you that the same "hysterical mass media" in America actually broke the story of U.S. soldiers shooting at Korean civilians and conducting mass killings...

Really the American mass media EVERY day warm the americans about shooting civils in Korea , like they warn them about "iranian paranoya" (http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4290667,00.html)?
Hmmn, which exactly channels you watch ,my friend?I want them too..
P.S. Be very carefull, the New-York is filled by iranian terririst, if to believe NYPD;)


And? "Warmongers?" I think on the whole the U.S. gov't has been pretty reasonable and is hardly warmongering at this point. Did you not read of Israeli PM Netanyahu decrying now he's been snubbed lately?
You mean they US gov enough resonable NOT to start ANOTHER one military compaint , additionally to those DOZEN of wars they already wage ?While the ordinary americans losing a jobs inside USA and some start a riots, sure they should be "pretty resonable" beeing in fear of possible people mass protests.While the domestic warmongers spend a billions , arming the Israel and send their own troops to fight for..nothing.Do you find this situation resonable?

Chevan
10-12-2012, 03:52 AM
Almost forgot..
The US increase their troops involved into Syrian civil war.
Pentagon deploys special forces to Jordan-Syria border (http://alethonews.wordpress.com/2012/10/10/confirmed-pentagon-deploys-special-forces-to-jordan-syria-border/)

Panetta’s comments came during a NATO conference of defense ministers in Brussels, where he said the US had been working with Jordan to monitor chemical and biological weapons sites in Syria and help the country deal with Syrian refugees crossing over the border.
The US has previously used Jordan as a base for other Syria-related military activities. In May of this year, Washington held military drills in Jordan dubbed ‘Operation Eager Lion,’ which saw around 12,000 troops from several nations participate in undisclosed training exercises.
All this international gang from "several nations" ( aka "Syrian national opposition")is trained and armed by US. No doubts those crowd will took active part in bloody conflict in Syria as "part of FSA".
COnsidering the point that CIA has been caught in organisation of training camps (http://syria360.wordpress.com/2012/08/01/blackwater-training-fsa-terrorists-in-turkey/) for islamist/mojahedens in Turkey the situation seems is getting more complicated. In fact there an discovering the organisation of entire intervention against Syria.

Nickdfresh
10-15-2012, 11:23 AM
DO you know a difference between the "people" and extremists?How do you qualify the people who explode the few officials , killing the dozen of civils?

Are you talking about the Syrian gov't forces or the FSA?


By whom the photos been realized?Nicki?You like a kid ;)Look at the root..
If to folow such a logic if the Nizis has realized the photos of etnic germans brutally killed by poles near Danzig - shall we to think the Poland is guit in all atrocities of ww2? It should be carefully investigated who's killed those poor children in Syria- ether assad secret police or anothe terrorisic group.
And WHEN the Sunni islamic mojahedens ( who were alongside FSA since most first Siege of Daraa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April%E2%80%93May_2011_Daraa_siege))and Al-quada was a ..."peaceful"?This is absolutli new for me, can you inform please?


Um, what does the German invasion of Poland have to do with it? The FSA is mainly Syrian and Syrian Army defectors. They're not an exterior nation invading another. Your Siege of Daraa link hardly helps your case, if this were simply a counterterrorist operation as the Syrian Assad regimes wants everyone to believe, then why did they not send in special operations soldiers? They sent in a "reliable" mechanized division and conducted a military siege operation. These are the acts of an extremely unpopular gov't, not of one carrying out surgical counterterror operations...


If you a really very interested the history - you should know the Syria is not the only state which used the artillery against internal terrorist . All the other states in Middle East, including beloved Israel , used it CONSTANTLY and STILL ,killing the civils ( not only their own)?
Why ONLY Assad regime called "bloody" and needed to be overthrown ?Lets start from most first "candidates"..Say , why not to start from Libya immediatelly?Where bloody islamist killed an american ambassador?

Oh , that's fine- look like the democratic secularist might have a close friendship with Islamist from all of the world:)Seems the "democrats" in FSA care about fight for power more then for a DEMOCRACY.
Just wonder why those idiots in USA still spend a billions , figting the Islamist from Al-queda..Is it inevitable to fight them you you are arm them?

What Israel did in 1948 doesn't really have much to do with this, nor does the terror attack in Libya against the American embassy. In fact it was the liberation of Libya from the bizarre Qaddafi that has actually served as a moderating force. Libyans turned out in droves to protest the attack on the embassy and reject lawlessness and violence of Islamist militias. Libya is hardly a comparison that benefits your views. The gov't there is struggling to combine the militia forces into a disciplined, regular army--the Embassy attacks have only strengthened this resolve and the populace behind it...


Really the American mass media EVERY day warm the americans about shooting civils in Korea , like they warn them about "iranian paranoya" (http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4290667,00.html)?
Hmmn, which exactly channels you watch ,my friend?I want them too..
P.S. Be very carefull, the New-York is filled by iranian terririst, if to believe NYPD;)

Or Moscow is filled with Chechen terrorists if you believe the Militsiya? And while I'm not a fan of "Iranian paranoia," Iran did attempt to assasinate the Saudi Embassador to the U.S. in Washington, D.C. And it has been shown that many of the Iranian special forces have been behind attacks on U.S. forces that were in Iraq and some of their elite units can be rogue and acting beyond their gov't...


You mean they US gov enough resonable NOT to start ANOTHER one military compaint , additionally to those DOZEN of wars they already wage ?While the ordinary americans losing a jobs inside USA and some start a riots, sure they should be "pretty resonable" beeing in fear of possible people mass protests.While the domestic warmongers spend a billions , arming the Israel and send their own troops to fight for..nothing.Do you find this situation resonable?

I'm not sure what your complaint is here? That America wants to become involved in the Syrian Civil War directly? Hardly. If it was, the FSA would probably have a much better arsenal and more ammunition, which is what is allowing the Assad Forces to keep them from taking control...

Nickdfresh
10-15-2012, 11:28 AM
Almost forgot..
The US increase their troops involved into Syrian civil war.
Pentagon deploys special forces to Jordan-Syria border (http://alethonews.wordpress.com/2012/10/10/confirmed-pentagon-deploys-special-forces-to-jordan-syria-border/)

Of course. Are there no Spetnatz or Quds Force/IRG's units there?


All this international gang from "several nations" ( aka "Syrian national opposition")is trained and armed by US....

Absurd. The U.S. does NOT directly arm the opposition, they don't have too. There are a number of Sunni states such as Saudi Arabia sending weapons and money to the FSA, the CIA is trying to curtail this actually and insure only more moderate elements get the money. If the CIA and the US military was in actual control of arming and training, things might be quite a bit different...

Chevan
10-16-2012, 01:26 PM
Are you talking about the Syrian gov't forces or the FSA?

I'm talking about the poples like who have orginized the 9'11. Syrian gov or fsa-mojahedens?


Um, what does the German invasion of Poland have to do with it? The FSA is mainly Syrian and Syrian Army defectors. They're not an exterior nation invading another. Your Siege of Daraa link hardly helps your case, if this were simply a counterterrorist operation as the Syrian Assad regimes wants everyone to believe, then why did they not send in special operations soldiers? They sent in a "reliable" mechanized division and conducted a military siege operation. These are the acts of an extremely unpopular gov't, not of one carrying out surgical counterterror operations...

I was meaning not german invasion but atrocities- you have NO right to put a responsibility for ALL atrocities at the ONE side. Especialy when the opposite side is well known for it's ethnic and religious cruelty.And if THEY are not the EXTERNAL nation invading the Syria- why then the ESSENTIAL part of them are the FOREIGN fighters and much of them are islamic radicals. Why then they ALL are armed by the external side like Saudi and Quatar?Why they trained by CIA and Tyrkey in foreign camps?They are all the "Syrian opposition" - aren't they?And if you think the "special operation soldiers" is enough for fighting the Islamic terrorists- why to the hell , the US, send to fight the al-quaeda ENTIRE the coalition in afganistan with drones and tanks, instead to send there just the limited "special forces"?You are a bit tricky seems.If the syrian gov so "unpopular" as CNN lies - why then the Assad resist so hard and so long time, that the CIA going to launch entire external "international" invasion to overthrow the syrian regime?


What Israel did in 1948 doesn't really have much to do with this, nor does the terror attack in Libya against the American embassy.
In fact it was the liberation of Libya from the bizarre Qaddafi that has actually served as a moderating force. Libyans turned out in droves to protest the attack on the embassy and reject lawlessness and violence of Islamist militias. Libya is hardly a comparison that benefits your views.

Really? So they has bombed Lybia into the stone age , killing the tens of thousands JUST to benefit the killing Quadaffi and ...get there the "lawlessness Islamist militias" . Great!!
This is exaclty what does expect the poor Syria if the bloody juhadist win the war.This is very well comparision!


The gov't there is struggling to combine the militia forces into a disciplined, regular army--the Embassy attacks have only strengthened this resolve and the populace behind it...

Yeah , the Al-quaeda will be difinitelly disciplined army:)


Or Moscow is filled with Chechen terrorists if you believe the Militsiya?

Have just invented it?Where did you see the Moscow police inform the population of "chechen threat"?


And while I'm not a fan of "Iranian paranoia," Iran did attempt to assasinate the Saudi Embassador to the U.S. in Washington, D.C. And it has been shown that many of the Iranian special forces have been behind attacks on U.S. forces that were in Iraq and some of their elite units can be rogue and acting beyond their gov't...

Who did say you that was IRAN behind this provocation?CNN?


I'm not sure what your complaint is here? That America wants to become involved in the Syrian Civil War directly? Hardly. If it was, the FSA would probably have a much better arsenal and more ammunition, which is what is allowing the Assad Forces to keep them from taking control...
Have terrorist a shortage of ammunition ever?!!common , turn off your zombie-TV. Check out the youtube better.
The terrorist have an entire arsenal of heavy wearpon - from the Stingers AA-missles (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNw_XcLu5qg) to the mortars (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5lzjH2mgns) and big-caliber guns (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5ThC3odfcs). And yes, the USA , has already been INVOLVED into the Syrian war- wish it or not. Via the CIA dirty activity.

Chevan
10-16-2012, 01:44 PM
The U.S. does NOT directly arm the opposition, they don't have too. ... the CIA is trying to curtail this actually and insure only more moderate elements get the money.
Oh that's so pity!!!Wish to look at those "moderate elements" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h338574kbDU). Seems the CIA makes their job too BAD;)


If the CIA and the US military was in actual control of arming and training, things might be quite a bit different...
No doubts it will be different very soon, the Sharia law and wild muslim justice (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JH_NnrSN4Qs&feature=relmfu) will be benefited to USA, unlike the cruel Assad regime...

Chevan
10-16-2012, 02:04 PM
And additionally, just for pure educative purposes.
Take a look at sort of democracy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=ALnQLDQnoQI) they FSA fight for in Syria.The beheading of peoples, suicide bombers , mass ethnic murders and fierce , absolute wild cruelty Sharia law - the things the democracy can't live without, as CIA claims !!! Have thay showed such a matter on CNN?!!!No?Too busy , exposuring the danger Iranian threat?

Nickdfresh
10-28-2012, 12:02 PM
By the Monitor's Editorial Board | Christian Science Monitor (http://news.yahoo.com/syrias-youtube-war-could-win-war-120300545--politics.html) – 3 hrs ago

Another failed United Nations-brokered truce in Syria over the weekend should now force the outside world to again ask: What can stop the violence?

More than 30,000 people have been killed in a conflict sparked 19 months ago when the military arrested 15 teenagers writing graffiti – “The people want the downfall of the regime” – that revealed an unspoken truth. Since then, peaceful protests have largely given way to a civil war that’s also spilling over Syria’s borders. Russia and the United States can’t agree on what to do, so little is done from the outside.

That leaves either more violence to resolve the conflict or something else. What might that something else be?

Perhaps it is the parallel war being waged by the opposition on YouTube to convince the remaining Syrians who support Bashar el-Assad that the regime now survives only on a thin tissue of lies.

One of the more popular chants during demonstrations has been “Syrian media is a liar!” To challenge the state’s censorship and its massive propaganda machine, the opposition has smartly used the Internet, relying on satellite connections to upload videos on YouTube. Many Syrians rely heavily on their satellite dishes to watch these daily depictions of what the regime actually does.

The effect is powerful. A string of myths has been knocked down, starting with Mr. Assad’s superficial attempt at political reform last year. Also gone is the regime’s pretense of widespread support in the Arab and Muslim world.

The videos have shattered Assad’s claim that he represents all of Syria’s diverse people by showing how much he now relies on support from his minority Alawite community. The current videos are countering the regime’s claim that the pro-democracy opposition is run by Islamic terrorists.

Assad is losing this war over the truth as more Syrians wake up to the unreality of the regime’s lies. It is forcing him to use state media to build up the Army as a unifying icon rather than himself. TV programs depict soldiers as brave and magnanimous toward the people. Some clips show crowds yelling, “God save the Army!”

Meanwhile, the foot soldiers themselves, who are mainly from the Sunni majority, are ordered not to watch the Internet. And with the opposition able to reveal Army massacres of innocent women and children, as well as whole villages, the military itself is losing credibility.

The Internet’s ability to democratize information could be the way to bring political democracy to Syria. Its power resides in allowing the masses to sift fact from fiction, which also helps lift their fears. Syrians can make better choices to live the truth of their broader community. The old lies spun by Assad are seen as powerless.

Many ruthless regimes have collapsed without a shot when the truth pours into a country. East Germans, for example, rose up against their communist rulers after years of being able to watch West German television beamed across the border. During a 1986 revolt in the Philippines, a Christian radio station countered the regime’s lies about the extent of its popular support.

Outside Syria, the United States and other nations are providing communication technology and training to help the opposition spread the videos. With few foreign journalists in Syria, the rest of the world also relies on these visual reports.

The more that Assad tries new ways to claim that he has staying power, the easier it becomes for the opposition to win the YouTube war. With enough massive noncooperation from Syrians, the regime will be cornered, perhaps creating more violence for a while, but eventually it will collapse.

Democracy itself is humanity’s best means of bringing out truths to run society. In Syria, hollowing out the lies is the first step toward creating new representations of truth. With that victory, the YouTube revolution can lead to democratic representation for all Syrians.

Chevan
10-29-2012, 03:26 AM
Nick, what is sense to link at youtube ,claiming it advocate the democracy, if everything i saw about atrocities commited by Al-qaeda mojahedens in Syria have been posted there?
Do you watch the youtube yourself?

Nickdfresh
10-30-2012, 11:20 AM
Nick, what is sense to link at youtube ,claiming it advocate the democracy, if everything i saw about atrocities commited by Al-qaeda mojahedens in Syria have been posted there?
Do you watch the youtube yourself?

Not the rebels' channel, I've seen the official gov't channel complete with a very pretty young female broadcaster and claims that the FSA had murdered and entire village--while it was under occupation of the Syrian Army no less. It seems to exist solely to blame every atrocity on the Free Syrian Army and is now widely discredited by UN monitors among others...

Chevan
10-31-2012, 10:45 AM
Not the rebels' channel, I've seen the official gov't channel complete with a very pretty young female broadcaster and claims that the FSA had murdered and entire village--while it was under occupation of the Syrian Army no less. It seems to exist solely to blame every atrocity on the Free Syrian Army and is now widely discredited by UN monitors among others...
I'm not talking about pro-assad channel. I'm about the atrocities ,executed and shoted by FSA members itself. Why those atrocities are uploaded and used exclusively by assad supporters in youtube unless there are the UN monitors , which shall inform I ( on his own duty) the world oppinion and investigate all of such cases? If , at it is getting quite clear from youtube, UN monitors keep silence about atrocities , commited by FSA, focusing purely on assad's brutality- which else the fact can discredite them more effective?

Nickdfresh
10-31-2012, 11:03 AM
You're mistaken, the Assad supporters take footage of victims after they've murdered them, then upload video and images claiming it was FSA "terrorists." I've never said the FSA doesn't commit atrocities, they certainly do, but the Assad regime's forces are responsible for the vast majority. Their use of heavy military weapons on civilian neighborhoods of particular ethnic groups is evidence of that...

Chevan
11-06-2012, 01:41 AM
You're mistaken, the Assad supporters take footage of victims after they've murdered them, then upload video and images claiming it was FSA "terrorists."

What with you?
I've linked a few of videos that shows the FIERCE PROCESS of EXECUTIONS ( not the dead bodies ,as FSA like to pose) of pows or "assad supporters" by FSA. Where those monsters proudly shout "allah acbar"? Is that what assad supporters falsified you think?Or my eyes fools me?


I've never said the FSA doesn't commit atrocities, they certainly do, but the Assad regime's forces are responsible for the vast majority. Their use of heavy military weapons on civilian neighborhoods of particular ethnic groups is evidence of that...
You missed to provide the evidence that "vast majority" is NOT a propogandic myth , shared by Zombie-NN and Co in aim to descredit the Assad and destabilize Syria.When his "democratic opposition" OBVIOUSLY doesn't even care to hide the ethnic attrocities , commited by their Al-quaeda suini allies .The situation with ethnic terror dramatically rises since the foreign suini jihadists flood the poor Syria, killing the christians and non-suini muslim- that the fact the zombie-media try to hide!Claiming that the terror rise since the heavy wearpon involved. While everybody know the US army itself constanly use the heavy werpon against jihadists around the world!

Chevan
11-06-2012, 07:45 AM
..unexpectedly!!!
CIA confirms role in US consulate attack in Benghazi (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/9650199/CIA-confirms-role-in-US-consulate-attack-in-Benghazi.html)
The CIA seems stood behind the fierce attack on american consulate in Lybia.


The Wall Street Journal said the consulate was being used as a CIA operation, adding that of the 30 American officials evacuated from Benghazi following the assault, just seven worked for the State Department.
It also identified the two security contractors killed in the attack – former Navy SEALs Tyrone Woods and Glen Doherty – as working for the Central Intelligence Agency and not the State Department.
In a break from tradition, it said CIA Director David Petraeus did not attend the ceremony when the coffins arrived back on American soil in order to conceal the CIA operation in eastern Libya.
If the CIA rules in Libya, provoking the bloody mess( even after the supposed "end of hostilities" and death of Gadaffi), what should expect the Syrian people in a case the puppet "syrian opposition" will have won an ethnic war?

Nickdfresh
11-06-2012, 01:08 PM
What with you?
I've linked a few of videos that shows the FIERCE PROCESS of EXECUTIONS ( not the dead bodies ,as FSA like to pose) of pows or "assad supporters" by FSA. Where those monsters proudly shout "allah acbar"? Is that what assad supporters falsified you think?Or my eyes fools me?

I've seen these videos elsewhere, and am well aware that the FSA forces do often kill captured Assad Regime Army personnel. Unfortunately, the level of brutality was set long ago...


You missed to provide the evidence that "vast majority" is NOT a propogandic myth , shared by Zombie-NN and Co in aim to descredit the Assad and destabilize Syria.

Um, I'm not CNN's biggest fan by any means, but you obviously haven't watched much of it. There's very little mention of the war in the U.S. media these days, especially with the elections here today. In any case, CNN reported recently that FSA forces summarily executed several captured Syrian Army members after a string of successful ambushes...and there's not many people standing with the Assad regime these days other than the Iranians and the Russian gov't...


When his "democratic opposition" OBVIOUSLY doesn't even care to hide the ethnic attrocities , commited by their Al-quaeda suini allies .The situation with ethnic terror dramatically rises since the foreign suini jihadists flood the poor Syria, killing the christians and non-suini muslim- that the fact the zombie-media try to hide!Claiming that the terror rise since the heavy wearpon involved. While everybody know the US army itself constanly use the heavy werpon against jihadists around the world!

I don't recall them being referred to as a "democratic opposition.' But no one can simply refer to them as 'al Qaida terrorists' or jihadists either. Many in fact are politically moderate and relatively indifferent to religion.

And your point with the U.S. Army? The Russian Army certainly had no problem blowing up market places during the Chechen War. And the Army in Afghanistan is relatively light on firepower and heavy weapons as they don't really help all that much against guerrillas. I don't think they even have any M-1A2 Abrams tanks there, I could be wrong about that though. And there is a huge difference between using firepower on insurgents and deliberately targeting civilians with it!

Nickdfresh
11-06-2012, 01:15 PM
..unexpectedly!!!
CIA confirms role in US consulate attack in Benghazi (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/9650199/CIA-confirms-role-in-US-consulate-attack-in-Benghazi.html)
The CIA seems stood behind the fierce attack on american consulate in Lybia.

If the CIA rules in Libya, provoking the bloody mess( even after the supposed "end of hostilities" and death of Gadaffi), what should expect the Syrian people in a case the puppet "syrian opposition" will have won an ethnic war?

I have no idea what your point is with this and it is completely unrelated to the topic. But OF COURSE the CIA is in Libya!

There were no provocations. Why would a very weak, thinly defended embassy intentionally "provoke" an unpopular Islamic militia that most in Libya now hate and see as a destabilizing force. The CIA did have a 'reaction force' of about eight members to provide security, but they weren't at the embassy during the initial attack. There were also no U.S. Marines there for political considerations and because Benghazi was considered relatively safe. I don't know where you get your information, but it completely misrepresents the situation and there are indeed intelligence agencies of most nations operating in Libya, including the Russian SVR and FSB...

Chevan
11-07-2012, 01:30 PM
I've seen these videos elsewhere, and am well aware that the FSA forces do often kill captured Assad Regime Army personnel. Unfortunately, the level of brutality was set long ago...

So what , to hell, a sense to support the bloody "OUR ba..rds" , trying to exchange one regime by another?Is that an "holy" AIM the US and CO targets in Syria? To exchange the assad by the another pro-american bas'rds?How about the democracy and lives of poor syrians?


Um, I'm not CNN's biggest fan by any means, but you obviously haven't watched much of it. There's very little mention of the war in the U.S. media these days, especially with the elections here today. In any case, CNN reported recently that FSA forces summarily executed several captured Syrian Army members after a string of successful ambushes...and there's not many people standing with the Assad regime these days other than the Iranians and the Russian gov't...

Really? they finally start to tell a true?
Did they told you that th FSA terrorists "fighting the regime' almost killed the UN monitors group (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57435543/assad-syria-is-fighting-foreign-mercenaries/)?


In a fresh blow to the peace effort, the international monitors have been caught up in the violence as well.

A team of observers was evacuated from a tense town in northern Syria on Wednesday, one day after a roadside bomb hit their convoy and left them stranded overnight with rebel forces, a U.N. spokesman said. The team's vehicles were struck by the blast Tuesday during a mission in the northern town of Khan Sheikhoun. None of the observers was wounded, but they had to spend the night with rebels in the area.

Hwo about to spend a night with "democratic rebels"?Much of impression will be guaranted!! The UN group proves:)The mojahedens so hard fight for democracy that explodes EVERYTHING, including the UN democrats:)I can imagine how many american ambasadors will be killed when the "democracy" finally won in Syria.


I don't recall them being referred to as a "democratic opposition.'

Oh so short memory!! No wonder - seeing too much CNN and ABC ( or what else you look ?) never could be useful in traning memory or IQ.Poor my friend;)Let me remind you.AGAIN..
The Syriansupport group (http://www.syriansupportgroup.org/)


"A support for establish free, independent, democratic Syria"- is it not NICE?! It almost make me cry..
And NOTICE the sign:
"The Syrian Support Group has received license from the U.S. Department of Treasury
Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) to legally raise funds to support the Free Syrian Army"

I think they just forgget to add - "Allah Acbar!!" down the page.SO would be better for collections of funds:) The Syrian mojahedens so POOR that US even has to organize the fund to support jihad.
No, i know it's not a first time the US sponsors the Jihadist- there were the same in Afganistan and Bosnia. But, to call such a support- the "fight for democracy"- this is just geniously!!!How do you think?


But no one can simply refer to them as 'al Qaida terrorists' or jihadists either. Many in fact are politically moderate and relatively indifferent to religion.

So why ALL of them , aka "moderate", shout "Allah Acbar" killing anybody on ANY VIDEO in youtube?Are you for "civilized mans" or for "savagery" Nicki?


And your point with the U.S. Army? The Russian Army certainly had no problem blowing up market places during the Chechen War. And the Army in Afghanistan is relatively light on firepower and heavy weapons as they don't really help all that much against guerrilla!
Yes, so you see, we ALL uses the heavy weapon against terrorists. Why then assad can't?

Chevan
11-07-2012, 01:40 PM
I have no idea what your point is with this and it is completely unrelated to the topic. But OF COURSE the CIA is in Libya!

The idea is so simple!!! The CIA:)
They are not just doing their job in Lybia - they are in Syria too. But if to look carefully at what heppend to Lybia NOW- the ugly Islamic militia and ets- you should start to think!! The situation in Lybia NOW is a EXACTLY what is expecting Syrian after final defeat of assad. The CIA and who stand behind them obvioulsy don't care neither about democracy nor about syrians, otherwise how they let those ugly Islamic militicia take a controll over country which wasn't radical during Gadaffi. Finally we have an ONE more radical muslim state - Lybia, the well basis for Al-queda. Which seems doesn't even border the CIA.But it should border ANY thinking american!!
Why not start thinking right now?
What does expect the peoples in Syria after downfall of moderate regime of assad on vivid example of Libya?

Chevan
11-07-2012, 01:44 PM
One more qite informative matter about how simular censorship works on BBC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ltz5M8L5VRw&feature=fvsr

he BBC has sensationally censored a news story and a video showing Syrian rebels forcing a prisoner to become a suicide bomber, a war crime under the Geneva Conventions, presumably because it reflected badly on establishment media efforts to portray the FSA as glorious freedom fighters.
[forcing a prisoner to become a suicide bomber clip]
http://youtu.be/Fbxz6THXsf4
The video, a copy of which can be viewed above (the original BBC version was deleted), shows Free Syrian Army rebels preparing a bomb that is loaded onto the back of a truck to be detonated at a government checkpoint in the city of Aleppo.

The clip explains how the rebels have commandeered an apartment belonging to a Syrian police captain. The rebels are seen sneering at photos of the police captain's family while they proclaim, "Look at their freedom, look how good it is," while hypocritically enjoying the luxury of the man's swimming pool.

The video then shows a prisoner who the rebels claim belonged to a pro-government militia. Bruises from torture on the prisoner's body are explained away as having been metered out by the man's previous captors. The BBC commentary emphasizes how well the rebels are treating the man, showing them handing him a cigarette.

However, the man has been tricked into thinking he is part of a prisoner exchange program when in reality he is being set up as an unwitting suicide bomber. The prisoner is blindfolded and told to drive the truck towards a government checkpoint.
"What he doesn't know is that the truck is the one that's been rigged with a 300 kilo bomb," states the narrator.

The clip then shows rebels returning disappointed after it's revealed that the remote detonator failed and the bomb did not explode.

The BBC narrator admits that forcing prisoners to become suicide bombers "would certainly be considered a war crime."
Who else doubt to use a heavy weaponry agains such a "rebels"?

Nickdfresh
11-08-2012, 10:05 AM
So what , to hell, a sense to support the bloody "OUR ba..rds" , trying to exchange one regime by another?Is that an "holy" AIM the US and CO targets in Syria? To exchange the assad by the another pro-american bas'rds?How about the democracy and lives of poor syrians?

What would make a new regime necessarily bloody? Libya's new gov't isn't. Certainly they're better than that nutty ******* Gaddafi was...


Really? they finally start to tell a true?
Did they told you that th FSA terrorists "fighting the regime' almost killed the UN monitors group (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57435543/assad-syria-is-fighting-foreign-mercenaries/)?

So? They made a mistake then took care of the UN monitors, that happens in war. And did you selectively read the article and skip the part on how Assad's forces intentionally opened fire on a civilian funeral procession? They seem rather trigger happy when it comes to large crowds at funerals and breadlines you know...


Hwo about to spend a night with "democratic rebels"?Much of impression will be guaranted!! The UN group proves:)The mojahedens so hard fight for democracy that explodes EVERYTHING, including the UN democrats:)I can imagine how many american ambasadors will be killed when the "democracy" finally won in Syria.

Oh so short memory!! No wonder - seeing too much CNN and ABC ( or what else you look ?) never could be useful in traning memory or IQ.Poor my friend;)Let me remind you.AGAIN..
The Syriansupport group (http://www.syriansupportgroup.org/)

I don't imagine they'll let another ambassador get killed in a terrorist incident. Why do you care so much about American diplomatic personnel now?


I think they just forgget to add - "Allah Acbar!!" down the page.SO would be better for collections of funds:) The Syrian mojahedens so POOR that US even has to organize the fund to support jihad.
No, i know it's not a first time the US sponsors the Jihadist- there were the same in Afganistan and Bosnia. But, to call such a support- the "fight for democracy"- this is just geniously!!!How do you think?

So why ALL of them , aka "moderate", shout "Allah Acbar" killing anybody on ANY VIDEO in youtube?Are you for "civilized mans" or for "savagery" Nicki?

Yes, so you see, we ALL uses the heavy weapon against terrorists. Why then assad can't?


"Allah Akbar" is a pretty standard refrain in the Arab world and is often used even by secular Muslims. And if you're using Bosnia as an example of Islamic extremism, you're quite possibly losing your mind as the securing of Bosnia-Herzegovina created a pro-Western democracy and a bastion against extremism. The Afghan jihadist argument is old and tired and the CIA never directly aided Bin Laden's groups there and allowed the ISI and more extreme elements to be supported by the Saudis unfortunately. But the Soviets certainly didn't appear successful in fighting Islamic extremism there, did they? The USSR actually had as much to do with the radicalization of the population there as anyone.

And I never said Assad can't use heavy weapons on "terrorists", or what most people think is a legitimate army of resistance. The point is he used heavy weapons to purposely target civilians, and does to this day as Syrian women and children are routinely targeted in breadlines...

Nickdfresh
11-08-2012, 10:08 AM
The idea is so simple!!! The CIA:)
They are not just doing their job in Lybia - they are in Syria too. But if to look carefully at what heppend to Lybia NOW- the ugly Islamic militia and ets- you should start to think!! The situation in Lybia NOW is a EXACTLY what is expecting Syrian after final defeat of assad. The CIA and who stand behind them obvioulsy don't care neither about democracy nor about syrians, otherwise how they let those ugly Islamic militicia take a controll over country which wasn't radical during Gadaffi. Finally we have an ONE more radical muslim state - Lybia, the well basis for Al-queda. Which seems doesn't even border the CIA.But it should border ANY thinking american!!
Why not start thinking right now?
What does expect the peoples in Syria after downfall of moderate regime of assad on vivid example of Libya?

So what? Are you seriously suggesting that Ghaddafi was better than the current Libyan gov't? Are you seriously calling Assad's regime "moderate?"

Nickdfresh
11-08-2012, 10:11 AM
One more qite informative matter about how simular censorship works on BBC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ltz5M8L5VRw&feature=fvsr

Who else doubt to use a heavy weaponry agains such a "rebels"?

I can't comment on the video now I don't have time, but "Infowars" is a joke and Alex Jones is a ****wit who routinely makes conspiratorial, sensationalist claims that have noting to do with reality. I think there's a video on Youtube showing dozens of his "predictions" that never came through, yet he never admits he's wrong.

Chevan
11-12-2012, 01:30 AM
What would make a new regime necessarily bloody? Libya's new gov't isn't. Certainly they're better than that nutty ******* Gaddafi was...

How to say!?Do you think that ugly Islamic militia provoking the riots, sunni ethnic terror and ruthless Sharia law - aren't ENOUGH bloody by your mind?At least it didn't happen within Gaddafi rule..


So? They made a mistake then took care of the UN monitors, that happens in war. And did you selectively read the article and skip the part on how Assad's forces intentionally opened fire on a civilian funeral procession? They seem rather trigger happy when it comes to large crowds at funerals and breadlines you know...

You seems pretty selectively take the ALL matter as well. The fact of attack on UN convoy just proves the "rebels" has no absolutly rules in their terrorist war and targets ALL the vehicles , including civils!!!The UN observers were a damn lucky not being killed by explosion.And , as the article is pro-western ( anti-assad) and biased they also have mentioned the "opened fire on a civilian funeral procession"- which doesn't clarify the reasons of fire!it might be the answered fire , provoked by previous attack, so simular for terrorist.



"Allah Akbar" is a pretty standard refrain in the Arab world and is often used even by secular Muslims.

This is just widespread nonsense! The arab world is a NOT ALL THE SAME.The secular Muslim don't praise allah , killing anybody! The secular muslim are the ordinary assad soldiers - they muslim as well and they are not shout "allah acbar" in a combat.Just coz they enough secular and civilized( in terms of regular army discipline). The Syrian muslims are not the match to the crazy WAHABI radical fighters from Saudi.
The secular muslims on the West are the civilized peaceful people who can't hurt anybody on ethnic or religious basis.DO you hint on that ugly crowd of b..rds wich throwed the people from top of building are SECULAR?


And if you're using Bosnia as an example of Islamic extremism, you're quite possibly losing your mind as the securing of Bosnia-Herzegovina created a pro-Western democracy and a bastion against extremism. The Afghan jihadist argument is old and tired and the CIA never directly aided Bin Laden's groups there and allowed the ISI and more extreme elements to be supported by the Saudis unfortunately. But the Soviets certainly didn't appear successful in fighting Islamic extremism there, did they? The USSR actually had as much to do with the radicalization of the population there as anyone.

Yes , they didn't , just like the unsuccesfull Americans NOW there. Sure the idiot Breznev did a much for radicalizasion of Afganistan by ugly soviet imperial policy there. But wasn't that not Zbignev Brzeginsky who went to Ben-Laden and discussed the us military help to radicals?And if Saudi is so nasty supporting the Al-quada all around world- why then US finaly invaded Afganistan instead to start intervention agains Jihadist in Saidi?
They seems just use the "jihadist war theme ' to justify the own imperialism,aren't they?


And I never said Assad can't use heavy weapons on "terrorists", or what most people think is a legitimate army of resistance. The point is he used heavy weapons to purposely target civilians, and does to this day as Syrian women and children are routinely targeted in breadlines...
So the US/Israel targets the ONLY terrorist!!!??Come on Niki. I wrote you - you are TOO old to be naive?Or yo specially fools me?
When US fough Faluji, Iraq in 2004 and used the white -phosphorous shells which caused a serious casualties among civils , including a lot of woman and children - Its OK!!
When US army wiped out entires villiages in Nothern Vietnam , bombed it with Orange( still there born a babies with serious defects (http://yahooeu.ru/horror/2038-zhertvy_jada_vo_vetname.html)) - No problems , this is everything for democracy and WOMAN AND CHILDREN!!!
If the Assad use the artillery - this is a crime against woman and children?
What is going on? The CIA has recruited you?So far you've been responsible ,critically thinking and social-oriented american.Not you just repeat that propogandic nonsense from CNN!
Why do you think should assad target to kill the OWN Syrian women and children? Unless the terrorist used the civils as cover, attcking the army from building , full of civils?

Chevan
11-12-2012, 02:37 AM
So what? Are you seriously suggesting that Ghaddafi was better than the current Libyan gov't? Are you seriously calling Assad's regime "moderate?"
What is a "current Libyan gov"?Seems you have no idea.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/25/opinion/bringing-libya-under-control.html?_r=0


The Libyan government sits on the sidelines avoiding conflicts with militias it cannot control. Recent attempts to subdue Qaddafi holdouts in the town of Bani Walid ended in humiliation; government forces were outgunned and outfought. Their weakness results from the lack of a crucial institution for state building: a national army.

Government officials recently announced plans to disarm the militias and integrate former rebels into the army. But there is no army structure to absorb these young fighters — and increase public confidence in the government’s ability to otherwise disarm them.

The current gov controls nothing except their homes. The real force in Syria is a former Qaddafy supporters and Islamic militia - both are non-managed force for "govenment". The people in Libya lives in FEAR of constant of terror.The violence still a common. Is that a real alternative to moderate ( more or less) Qadaffi rule, you think?
http://www.examiner.com/article/nato-occupies-all-petroleum-platforms-libya


“Clearly the US is protecting Libyan oil for western corporations”, says Matt Black of Charlotte.

US troop presence has been reported in Brega, Ras Lanouf and Sirte - in order to help themselves to Libyan oil so that Western corporation get the oil at a very cheap price...if not totally for free.

PEOPLE LIVING IN FEAR

Meanwhile, according to foreign news reports “the people of Libya live in constant fear.”

This in a country where not long ago, anyone..man, woman or child, could safely venture out any time of night or day without fear of molestation. Now no one is safe, even in their own home.

“There is little food, people are starving. They wait in lines for hours to get their own gas. There is no running water or electricity.” Says Mary Abrara of Libya.

This is fast becoming the signature situation of US military interventionism around the world.

Nickdfresh
11-14-2012, 01:57 PM
How to say!?Do you think that ugly Islamic militia provoking the riots, sunni ethnic terror and ruthless Sharia law - aren't ENOUGH bloody by your mind?At least it didn't happen within Gaddafi rule..

Plenty of blood was shed under Qaddafi's rule, including terrorist attacks on American civilians (Pam Am 103). If you want to believe ALL the Rebels ARE ALL THE SAME when only a small minority are Islamist, fine. There's no point in discussing it and we'll agree to disagree. We'll only know who comes to power once Assad is dead...


You seems pretty selectively take the ALL matter as well. The fact of attack on UN convoy just proves the "rebels" has no absolutly rules in their terrorist war and targets ALL the vehicles , including civils!!!The UN observers were a damn lucky not being killed by explosion.And , as the article is pro-western ( anti-assad) and biased they also have mentioned the "opened fire on a civilian funeral procession"- which doesn't clarify the reasons of fire!it might be the answered fire , provoked by previous attack, so simular for terrorist.

So, at the very worst, you're saying the rebels are as bad as Assad's regime forces?


This is just widespread nonsense! The arab world is a NOT ALL THE SAME.The secular Muslim don't praise allah , killing anybody! The secular muslim are the ordinary assad soldiers - they muslim as well and they are not shout "allah acbar" in a combat.Just coz they enough secular and civilized( in terms of regular army discipline). The Syrian muslims are not the match to the crazy WAHABI radical fighters from Saudi.
The secular muslims on the West are the civilized peaceful people who can't hurt anybody on ethnic or religious basis.DO you hint on that ugly crowd of b..rds wich throwed the people from top of building are SECULAR?

I never said they were "all the same." Just that there are typical religious refrains of celebration and woe in much of the Islamic world whether they are observant or more secular. It is a fact that during the Algerian Civil War of the early 1990's, that both members of the secular gov't Army and Islamic guerrillas would often shout the same refrains either celebratory or calling out God to help them when wounded. "Crazy Wahabbist fighters"? How many (specifically) Saudis are there do you think?..


Yes , they didn't , just like the unsuccesfull Americans NOW there. Sure the idiot Breznev did a much for radicalizasion of Afganistan by ugly soviet imperial policy there. But wasn't that not Zbignev Brzeginsky who went to Ben-Laden and discussed the us military help to radicals?And if Saudi is so nasty supporting the Al-quada all around world- why then US finaly invaded Afganistan instead to start intervention agains Jihadist in Saidi?
They seems just use the "jihadist war theme ' to justify the own imperialism,aren't they?

Um, Brzezinski never spoke to a Bin Laden, Binnie probably wasn't even in Afghanistan yet and Brzezinski was only there for the beginning as the Carter Admin was defeated and Reagan took over beginning in 1981. Very little contact was between Bin Laden and the U.S. with maybe a few CIA agents on the ground that had some discussions with him. But the idea that Bin Laden came from the CIA is conspiratorial crap from those that have no understanding of the Soviet-Afghan War...


So the US/Israel targets the ONLY terrorist!!!??Come on Niki. I wrote you - you are TOO old to be naive?Or yo specially fools me?
When US fough Faluji, Iraq in 2004 and used the white -phosphorous shells which caused a serious casualties among civils , including a lot of woman and children - Its OK!!
When US army wiped out entires villiages in Nothern Vietnam , bombed it with Orange( still there born a babies with serious defects (http://yahooeu.ru/horror/2038-zhertvy_jada_vo_vetname.html)) - No problems , this is everything for democracy and WOMAN AND CHILDREN!!!
If the Assad use the artillery - this is a crime against woman and children?

I can't speak for the Israelis, but in fact the U.S. only does target insurgents/terrorists. Of course there are people killed in collateral damage of heavy weapons, but especially during The Surge in Iraq, the use of air strikes and artillery was sharply curtailed in order to win support of the population as per the counterinsurgency tactics adopted. As for Fallujah, certainly civilians died, but the city was largely emptied just prior too and in the early part of the battle and the white phosphorous was used against insurgent targets to clear the city.

In Vietnam, I highly doubt villages were destroyed in the North as that would have been pointless. Of course we did drop a lot of ordinance and certainly depopulated villages were wiped out in the South. As for Agent Orange, that was a defoliant and not a weapon. The users were largely ignorant of the health risk posed by DDT and of course the civilian population there suffered its horrendous effects--as did U.S. veterans also coming on contact with the defoliant...


What is going on? The CIA has recruited you?So far you've been responsible ,critically thinking and social-oriented american.Not you just repeat that propogandic nonsense from CNN!
Why do you think should assad target to kill the OWN Syrian women and children? Unless the terrorist used the civils as cover, attcking the army from building , full of civils?

Um, I am still critically thinking. Assad targets women and children in abortive crackdown with has had the opposite effect and is well documented. I work for the CIA? LOL Silly. You're the one that is basically spouting the official Russian line as the Russian gov't is one of the only factions that still support Assad, basically because they want to keep their access to naval port facilities there!

Nickdfresh
11-14-2012, 01:59 PM
What is a "current Libyan gov"?Seems you have no idea.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/25/opinion/bringing-libya-under-control.html?_r=0

Excellent NY Times article which goes a long way in saying what I've been saying, that the Libyan Gov't is struggling to integrate these separate militias into a standing gov't controlled, disciplined Army. That's perfectly understandable and predictable, the U.S. is now doing more to help I believe in training and equipping them...


The current gov controls nothing except their homes. The real force in Syria is a former Qaddafy supporters and Islamic militia - both are non-managed force for "govenment". The people in Libya lives in FEAR of constant of terror.The violence still a common. Is that a real alternative to moderate ( more or less) Qadaffi rule, you think?
http://www.examiner.com/article/nato-occupies-all-petroleum-platforms-libya

Are you talking about Syria or Libya?

Evillittlekenny
12-04-2012, 12:25 PM
I find it interesting how the coverage by the media differs by the region, politics of the media and other factors. I am reading this thread now (not nearly done yet), till now I have seen that Users from the US, Russia, Turkey, Ireland, Portugal and Ireland commented (sorry if I missed someone out), where I also assume that media coverage is different, partially hugely different. Some sympathic to the Rebels, some to the Assad regime, some restraining.


Of course, people do inform themselves also over other channels as well building their own opinion (I do not want to accuse anyone to be a media-muppet or so :D )


I have observed the discrepancy of the media coverage with 3 examples:

1) The Austrian media usually is on the side of the rebels, labelling them "freedom fighters" and labelling the Assad regime as "opressive and terroristic".

2) In Bosnia this summer when I went to a hairdresser, I read a bit in the newspapers and took a "Dnevni Avaz", a Bosniak (that is Muslim of Bosnia) newspaper. The newspaper took right the opposite point of view, calling the rebels "terrorist" while the Assad regime in their eyes is the "peaceful government" which is "defendind the state" against the aforementioned "terrorists". I do not remember now whether the rebels were also labelled anti-islamic in the newspaper.

3) At the same occassion I also read a newspaper of Bosnian Croats (the Bosnian variant of Večernji list). Surprisingly, their coverage was quite cold and emotionless. It was a nearly statistical account of victims on both sides with numbers of the government as well as those of the rebels published. Also, in another article they documented a case of "photo doctoring" undertaken by the Austrian "Krone" newspaper, merging a picture of some burning ruins as well as a picture of some presumably Arabic people running, though not under what one would call special circumstances. The result was a picture depicting burning ruins with people running away in front of them. Christoph Dichand admitted the doctoring of the pictures, stating that "it still depicts the plight of the people in Syria very well".

Chevan
12-06-2012, 12:03 PM
Of course, people do inform themselves also over other channels as well building their own opinion (I do not want to accuse anyone to be a media-muppet or so :D )

Yes of cource, but it isn't the ONLY we are talking about..
The matter not as much about difference over media's vertion of events , but about how cynicaly the mass media may ignore the sources that doesn't follows it's own "general politic line". In fact neither ZNN nor Putin's puppet RT don't even care to reflect the real situation in Syria. The youtube has a tonns of video of atrocities commiting by so called "FSA rebels" why those freaks still claims the terrorost fight against "tyranny". They explode the carbombs almost everyday, killing the civils in Damascus (http://news.antiwar.com/2012/09/01/two-car-bombs-explode-in-syria-rebels-suspected/) while the mass media try to create almost an parallel reality, affirms the rebels fight for sort of democracy..

Syrian opposition activists gave account to the bombings and could not be independently confirmed, but the targets appeared to be pro-government areas, although civilians were killed and injured in each attack.

The introduction of car bombs and suicide bombings into the Syrian conflict has been increasing as of late. These kinds of tactics are associated with the kind of sectarian violence of insurgents and militants in neighboring Iraq, called al-Qaeda and terrorism by the US.

In Syria though, Washington is not calling it terrorism. Instead, Washington is supporting the groups carrying out this violence in Syria, despite the fact that many of the same groups fought against the US and the Baghdad government it supports in Iraq.

“The evidence is mounting that Syria has become a magnet for Sunni extremists, including those operating under the banner of Al Qaeda,” the New York Times reported in July. “The presence of jihadists in Syria has accelerated in recent days in part because of a convergence with the sectarian tensions across the country’s long border in Iraq.”
According to one US intelligence estimate, as many as a quarter of the 300 rebel groups in Syria may be fighting under the banner of al-Qaeda, says Rep. Mike Rogers (R-MI), chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.

Earlier this month, a United Nations investigation found that rebel militias have committed war crimes along with the Syrian regime. But the Obama administration does not appear to be budging from its current policy of support for the rebels.
It's just getting more ridiculously then funny!!The US who spend so much political propogand ,resources and lives, fighting the Al Qaeda- now pump it up in Syria! Where are all the reasonable westerners looking at?

Chevan
12-06-2012, 12:34 PM
Um, I am still critically thinking. Assad targets women and children in abortive crackdown with has had the opposite effect and is well documented. I work for the CIA? LOL Silly. You're the one that is basically spouting the official Russian line as the Russian gov't is one of the only factions that still support Assad, basically because they want to keep their access to naval port facilities there!
I was kidding when wrote you works for CIA LOL;)
You just think and say accurate like your own mass media. And now - i don't care about those idiotic "putin's line" ( however i have to add the Putin at least doesn't call the terrorists as "democrats") and you are wrong if think it everything about weapon trade and phony geopolitical games from kremlin.But i do understand your HINT right coz the US imperial policy does exactly this way.
You think i'am anti-american - this is WRONG!!Whom , by your mind, the jihadist will kill next?Americans in Iraq and Afganistan!!!It's inevitable.You can't just train them or stop- thay will hunt and explode YOUR soldiers (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INT9d-owr8I) whatever you wrote they do i in Syria now and how heroically they fight with assad. And i'm not endeed happy about that. Just coz i share the views that Islamic terrorism is an ABSOLUTE evil. Looking like easy your domestic own mass media fools you and how your personal " enthusiasm" turn your mind into the pseudo-patriotism.

Nickdfresh
12-07-2012, 12:10 PM
Chevan, I don't know exactly what you find "inaccurate" in my mass media. There have always been concerns expressed about militant jihadists fighting in the FSA as well as several reports on the FSA summarily executing prisoners captured from Assad's forces. I've simply said they are not all Islamic fundamentalists, not even in the majority...

As for the thread overall, recent developments:

The FSA is going to topple Assad. They're fighting in the outskirts of Damascus, the Russians are beginning to abandon Assad, he's making inquiries about sanctuary countries to flee, and his government is about two or three months away from collapsing. Once Damascus is cut off, it's just a matter of time.

The truth is there will be no NATO ground troops involved in major battles, if they do go in, it will be to secure chemical weapons, which Assad is reportedly considering using....

Evillittlekenny
12-12-2012, 05:48 PM
I seem to have maybe stirred up some already forgotten discussion, sorry about that.

But I have one more question about it, did anyone hear something about infighting between the rebel groups? Someone in this thread remarked that there are possibly 100 different groups. The groups will differ in their views and goals largely, I wonder whether they put their own dispute aside to "solve" the Assad matter or whether they are already fightign each other.

Nickdfresh
01-13-2013, 02:17 PM
Syrian warplanes bomb rebellious Damascus suburbs
By BARBARA SURK | Associated Press (http://news.yahoo.com/syrian-warplanes-bomb-rebellious-damascus-suburbs-104650242.html) – 1 hr 19 mins ago
http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/DX257tZcRZlPZavWVyaDzg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Y2g9MTg5MDtjcj0xO2N3PTI4MzU7ZHg9MD tkeT0wO2ZpPXVsY3JvcDtoPTQyMDtxPTg1O3c9NjMw/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/c04d1d1e95378001260f6a7067002890.jpg
Men help a wounded civilian after a mortar attack in the Saif al-Dawlah neighborhood of Aleppo, Syria, Sunday, Jan. 13, 2013. The revolution against the Syrian regime started in March 2011 with peaceful protests but morphed into a civil war that has killed more than 60,000 people, according to a recent United Nations estimate. (AP Photo/Andoni Lubaki)

A street controlled by government forces is seen through a sniper in the Saif al-Dawlah neighborhood of Aleppo, Syria, Sunday, Jan. 13, 2013. The revolution against the Syrian regime started in March 2011 with peaceful protests but morphed into a civil war that has killed more than 60,000 people, according to a recent United Nations estimate. (AP Photo/Andoni Lubaki)View Photo


BEIRUT (AP) — Syrian fighter jets on Sunday bombed Damascus suburbs in a government offensive to dislodge rebels from strategic areas around the capital, activists said, as clashes raged around army bases and airfields in the country's north.

The Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said warplanes were hitting towns and villages around the capital, while regime forces targeted other neighborhoods with artillery and mortars. At least nine people were killed when a shell hit eastern Ghouta district, the group said.

Also Sunday, Turkish state media said Assad's fighter jets bombed the Syrian town of Azaz near the Turkish border.

At least 34 Syrians wounded in the airstrikes were brought across the border to the Turkish province of Kilis for treatment, the state-run Anadolu agency said. Seven died of the injuries, the report said.

The Observatory said troops were battling rebels in the suburb of Daraya a day after government officials claimed the army had taken much of the strategic area, which lies on the edge of a major military air base southwest of the capital.

In northern Syria, government forces were fighting rebels over an air base and the international airport of the city of Aleppo. The airport includes a military base.

Syrian troops have been pushing since November to regain Daraya, which had a population of about 200,000 before the fighting. Thousands have fled the relentless violence, among more than 2 million Syrians who have been internally displaced during the civil war. At least half a million Syrians have fled to neighboring countries like Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan.

Because of its strategic location, rebel control of the Daraya poses a particularly grave threat to the capital.

The suburb is flanked by the key districts of Mazzeh, home to a military air base, and Kfar Sousseh, where the government headquarters, the General Security intelligence agency head office and the Interior Ministry are located.

While Assad's loyalists appear to have an upper hand on the Damascus front due to the regime's air power, the rebels dealt the government a major blow in the north by capturing a sprawling air base in Idlib province on Friday.

Rebels retained control of the Taftanaz base Sunday and intensified their assault on the Mannagh air base and the international airport in Aleppo, Syria's largest city, activists said.

Among the rebels taking part in the battle are fighters from Jabhat al-Nustra, an Islamist group that the U.S. has branded a terrorist organization. Washington said the group, among the most organized and effective rebel forces on the ground, is affiliated with al-Qaida.

Syrian official statements regularly play up the role of Islamist militants in the civil war and refer to the rebels as terrorists.

More than 60,000 people have been killed since the revolt started almost two years ago.

Heavy fighting was reported Sunday in the northern province of Deir el-Zour, involving attacks by warplanes, activists said.

Last month an international aid group, Doctors Without Borders, said tens of thousands of Syrians, many of them wounded, are trapped in Deir el-Zour.

In Aleppo, where rebels fought troops to a stalemate last year, the two sides clashed near the air force intelligence building in the Zahra neighborhood.

The state-run SANA news agency said an army unit killed "a number of terrorists and destroyed a convoy of cars that was transporting weapons, ammunition and terrorists" in Deir el-Zour.

Prime Minister Wael al-Halqi formed a ministerial committee to conduct dialogue with opposition groups, SANA reported. The dialogue is part of efforts to implement a peace plan Assad outlined in a speech a week ago.

In his first address to the nation in six months, Assad rejected international calls to step down and offered to oversee a national reconciliation conference, while rejecting any talks with the armed opposition and vowing to continue fighting them.

The speech was condemned by the U.S. and its Western and Gulf Arab allies, while Assad's backers in Russia and Iran said his proposal should be considered.

In a rare demonstration in Damascus, dozens of protesters staged a sit-in at the Justice Ministry on Sunday, demanding the minister move against merchants who activists claim are trying to profit from the crisis by raising prices of cooking gas, flour and bread.

Food prices have soared in the past year in Syria, as the value of the local currency plummeted because of the conflict and an international ban on oil exports.

___

Associated Press writer Albert Aji in Damascus, Syria, and Suzan Fraser in Ankara, Turkey, contributed to this report.